HomeMy WebLinkAbout1/24/2012 - RegularJanuary 24, 2012 31
Roanoke County Administration Center
5204 Bernard Drive
Roanoke, Virginia 24018
The Board of Supervisors of Roanoke County, Virginia met this day at the
Roanoke County Administration Center, this being the fourth Tuesday and the second
regularly scheduled meeting of the month of January 2021. Audio and video recordings
of this meeting will be held on file for a minimum of five (5) years in the office of the
Clerk to the Board of Supervisors.
IN RE: CALL TO ORDER
Chairman Flora called the meeting to order at 3:00 p.m. The roll call was
taken.
MEMBERS PRESENT: Chairman Richard C. Flora; Supervisors Michael W. Altizer,
Joseph B. "Butch" Church, Eddie "Ed" Elswick and Charlotte
A. Moore
MEMBERS ABSENT: None
STAFF PRESENT: B. Clayton Goodman III, County Administrator; Diane D.
Hyatt, Assistant County Administrator; Daniel R. O'Donnell,
Assistant County Administrator; Paul M. Mahoney, County
Attorney; Teresa H. Hall, Director of Public Information and
Deborah C. Jacks, Clerk to the Board
IN RE: OPENING CEREMONIES
The invocation was given by Pastor Diane Hoffman of Church Victorious.
The Pledge of Allegiance was recited by all present.
IN RE: REQUESTS TO POSTPONE, ADD TO, OR CHANGE THE ORDER OF
AGENDA ITEMS
County Administrator B. Clayton Goodman III asked that the agenda item
under the Second Reading of Ordinances, the Ordinance amending Section 23 -3.4
"Stormwater management facility maintenance agreements" of Chapter 23. "Stormwater
Management" of the Roanoke County Code be moved to the evening session. There
was no objection.
IN RE: PROCLAMATIONS, RESOLUTIONS, RECOGNITIONS AND AWARDS
32 January 24, 2012
1. Resolution expressing the appreciation of the Board of
Supervisors of Roanoke County to Gladys M. Walters, Library
Services, upon her retirement after forty -four (44) years of service
Ms. Walters was in attendance for this recognition as well as Diana
Rosapepe, Director of Library Services. All supervisors congratulated and thanked Ms.
Walters for her service.
RESOLUTION 012412 -1 EXPRESSING THE APPRECIATION OF
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OF ROANOKE COUNTY TO
GLADYS M. WALTERS, LIBRARY SERVICES, UPON HER
RETIREMENT AFTER FORTY -FOUR (44) YEARS OF SERVICE
WHEREAS, Gladys M. "Totsie" Walters was first employed by Roanoke County
on October 30, 1967, by Library Services; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Walters retired from Roanoke County on December 31, 2011,
as Bent Mountain Branch Librarian, after forty -four (44) years and two (2) months of
service; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Walters offered friendship and assistance to everyone who
visited the library, transforming it into a welcoming community center and a true
educational resource for the people of Bent Mountain; and
WHEREAS, she opened the world of reading to generations of children who
came to the library for storytimes and after school; and
WHEREAS, during her tenure, Ms. Walters oversaw many changes in the Bent
Mountain Branch Library, including the construction of a new library in 1986 and a later
addition in 2005; the expansion of library operational hours; the introduction of new
formats and services, such as DVDs, computers with Internet access and e- books; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Walters, through all the changes, exemplified the highest
standards of calm, courteous, reliable and positive public service; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Walters, through her employment with Roanoke County, has
been instrumental in improving the quality of life for its citizens.
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that the Board of Supervisors of
Roanoke County expresses its deepest appreciation and the appreciation of the citizens
of Roanoke County to GLADYS M. WALTERS for forty -four (44) years of capable, loyal
and dedicated service to Roanoke County; and
FURTHER, the Board of Supervisors does express its best wishes for a happy
and productive retirement.
On motion of Supervisor Elswick to adopt the resolution, and carried by the
following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
NAYS: None
January 24, 2012 33
IN RE: BRIEFINGS
1. Annual update on services delivered by Blue Ridge Behavioral
Healthcare (Tim Steller, Executive Director of Blue Ridge
Behavioral Healthcare)
Mr. Steller provided an update on the community services provided by
Blue Ridge Behavioral Healthcare.
2. Annual report from the Roanoke Regional Partnership (Beth
Doughty, Executive Director)
Ms. Doughty gave a brief PowerPoint presentation on the Roanoke
Regional Partnership.
IN RE: NEW BUSINESS
1. Request for appropriation of funds for assessment for
Appalachian Power Company (APCo) negotiations (Anne Marie
Green, Director of General Services)
A- 012412 -2
Ms. Green explained the request for the appropriation of $4,889.35.
There was no discussion. Chairman Flora moved to approve the staff recommendation
to appropriate the funds for the Appalachian Power Company assessment. The motion
carried by the following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
NAYS: None
2. Discussion of the moratorium on approval of new street lights (B.
Clayton Goodman III, County Administrator)
Mr. Goodman advised this request was forwarded to the Board for
consideration on behalf of Board member Church. He advised he wanted to discuss the
issue that we had at our last work session and deferred to Supervisor Church.
Supervisor Church asked Mr. Goodman to tell the viewing audience really
what transpired during the work session and then he will have some comments to make
and a request.
Mr. Goodman advised staff added to the work session an item for
discussion of the streetlights, which was on the previous meeting in December.
Representatives of the Board discussed the possibility of lifting the moratorium for street
34 January 24, 2012
lights. There were approximately seven (7) streetlight that met the criteria that could be
eligible for consideration and at that time the Board consented to lifting the moratorium,
seek approval of those lights for installation and then consider any further requests in
regards to the moratorium reinstated and discussed during the budget process.
Supervisor Church asked Mr. Goodman to verify that the moratorium was
lifted during the work session. Supervisor Church advised for the viewing audience and
those at home, he was not present for this work session and he was a little bit disturbed
when he was told the moratorium was opened. He advised there was a request
December 13, 2011, at the Board's last meeting in 2011 from Ms. Moore regarding a
streetlight and remembered commenting at the end of the meeting that it would not be
proper to open a moratorium, put in one light and close it. He asked Mr. Goodman to
verify that there was one light in Cave Spring and six from Vinton talked about under
consensus and the moratorium was then closed with Mr. Goodman responding in the
affirmative and that it would be discussed during the budget process as to whether it
would be reopened, maintained, etc. Supervisor Church advised it is his understanding
and he has talked to some directors and people at the meeting, there was no discussion
about a budget situation. He added in his opinion the Board is sending a wrong
message by selecting a few chosen lights. He added he thinks in the era of
transparency and openness, i.e. there has been a moratorium on this street light
installation for two years and during that time and he does not know the number,
several of his citizens asked or talked to him about applying and he advised them there
was a moratorium on and they would be wasting their time. Supervisor Church then
asked Mr. Arnold Covey, Director of Community Development to explain the process
and the normal length of time it takes. Mr. Covey advised basically the process starts
with a phone call and then staff will submit an application to the person making the
request. The citizen fills out the application form and returns to the County. When the
County receives the completed application, the Transportation Department will prepare
maps and take a look at the street configuration. There is a form that staff goes through
to analyze the street light to see if it meets the qualifications or requirements of the
County regarding safety to the motoring public. Additionally, staff will coordinate with
the Police Department and that could take a couple weeks and then at that point staff
determines whether the light qualifies or not. If qualified, AEP is notified to schedule the
installation of the street light.
Supervisor Church asked Mr. Covey if the time frame is normally
approximately five to seven weeks, with Mr. Covey confirming. He advised that is why
he has been telling his citizens, there is a moratorium on it; it is a little bit of a process.
Additionally, some people think it is for the security of their home, which is not correct
and asked Mr. Covey to confirm. Mr. Covey advised they will look at the configuration
of the roadway and intersections and locations, etc. Supervisor Church stated the
budgeted amount for electricity is $104,000 a year with Mr. Covey responding in the
affirmative. Supervisor Church then asked Mr. Covey to confirm he has already spent
$128,000 with Mr. Covey responding in the affirmative. Supervisor Church advised he
was not talking about the amount of money, $500 does not sound like a lot, but when
January 24, 2012 35
you start putting a few hundred together it does. He advised there are 1495 streetlights
(approximately) currently with $24,000 over budget and asked Mr. Covey where does
the money come from with Mr. Covey responding a reallocation of dollars within his
budget will be needed to accommodate. Supervisor Church reiterated it comes from
another project and the Board does not give you extra money. He advised there is a
process that is not broken and feels that the Board is sending a wrong message. He
commented he feels when the Board does things like this; it creates a question in the
citizens' minds. Why would the Board open up for six (6) and not open it up for the
entire County. The reason is the County has been in a budget crunch or the
moratorium would not have been put on to begin with. Supervisor Church asked Mr.
Mahoney could he repeat to the audience in work sessions normally the Board will work
on item of interest to all of our districts and then the Board will come to consensus and
normally bring it downstairs to a live meeting. Is that a general way that this is handled
with Mr. Mahoney responding in the affirmative. Supervisor Church commented Mr.
Mahoney mentioned in the work session, "how about an appropriation of money" and
asked Mr. Mahoney to confirm. Mr. Mahoney advised there are two different
approaches, one in the past the Board has appropriated additional funds for different
projects or in the alternative, the Board just indicates that they want staff to reallocate
existing, appropriated funds within Department budgets. In this instance, he believed it
was the direction of the Board just to reallocate those funds within Mr. Covey's budget.
Supervisor Church commented in his opinion is that it is not the amount of
money, he stated he thinks it sends a wrong signal to the citizens that could have and
would be in line or on a waiting list for a potential streetlight, but there are people who
would not understand that six (6) particular lights, no matter where they are located,
would be done with the moratorium open and a moratorium closed and without anything
being brought up except "let's don't advertise this because we will have 25 more." He
stated he does not think that is the kind of situation that the citizens have come to
expect from this Board. Accordingly, he advised it is his request and he does not know
if there is any further discussion on the Board that they do not open up this moratorium;
it is not broken and was done for a reason. He further added he also does not think it is
fair for the Board to handle the situation with any Department Director arbitrarily whether
it is $500 or $5,000. He just thinks the Board is sending the wrong message to our
citizens and also to our Departments because this year the budget is worse by far than
last year and the Board has not even gotten into it. He stated at this point staff needs to
be tightening and sending a message out to our citizens. The issue is fairness and
openness and transparency. It cannot possibly, in his mind as one Board member,
have a moratorium opened, approve this six (6) and then shut it; it is so unfair and so
wrong. He again stated he is asking for something to be openly and fairly considered.
Supervisor Moore stated the Board is elected officials and they are elected
and obligated to represent the citizens and if they call and have a request it is the
Board's duty to make sure their concerns are met, especially if it is a public safety issue.
She advised she received a call on December 12, 2011, from a citizen in the Cave
Spring district asking about a streetlight. She had some pretty significant public safety
36 January 24, 2012
issues on her street. Supervisor Moore then stated she called Roanoke County
immediately and asked about a streetlight. She was told there was a moratorium on
streetlights and she requested to the County Administrator that the Board hold a work
session to address streetlights so that every Board member in every district could talk
about whether streetlights could be put on certain streets. She was told it would be on
the agenda, On the December 13, 2011 meeting when she did not see it on the agenda
officially, she was told this was a budget item and would done during budget review.
After the budget review, the streetlights were not mentioned and on the back of the
budget review was the information, but it was never gone over. She reiterated she
asked at the December 13, 2011, meeting if she could discuss, just two minutes, to
discuss the importance of these streetlights. She was denied the request, although in
all fairness, the Board was running behind and had to get to their next session. Ms.
Moore advised she assumed that this would be attached to the January 10, 2012,
meeting; the information was not attached and she again asked if she could discuss
streetlights. She was told at that time by the County Administrator this is a budget
issue, this is a staff decision and this is not a Board action. At this time, the Board then
discussed it, these seven (7) streetlights that had already met the criteria, the poles
were already there, AEP would not charge anything for the installation and out of public
safety for these seven (7) citizens that had already met the criteria a consensus was
reached that it would be fair to lift the moratorium to add these streetlights. She stated
she does think that the Board should have this discussion with every district, which is
why she requested that it be on the agenda and to say that no discussion about budget
was mentioned is wrong because Supervisor Church was not there to hear it. This is
what she was told not once, but twice. She does agree that the Board has protocol and
she is not trying to cause any dissention amongst the Board, but it is the Board's
obligation to represent its citizens and she feels the Board should leave it as is with the
seven (7) streetlights and then request another work session to see if the Board could
talk about other areas in the County and what their issues are.
Supervisor Elswick stated he is already beginning to get requests for
streetlights. People understood that the County was going to install them. Where he
lives, most people do it on their own and they pay the $5.00 a month themselves. If that
is all it is, it is not very expensive. He stated he thinks whatever the County's policy is
on streetlights ought to be the same throughout the County.
Supervisor Altizer stated if the Board needs to have a discussion on the
streetlights, he thinks it is a worthy discussion. It is a budget item. He stated he would
like to go back and answer the part about appropriation. He was the one in work
session that told Mr. Mahoney, "Why do we need to do an appropriation" because we
were going to do an intra- transfer of funds, which happens all the time. It happens on
library projects, different construction projects. An appropriation is not done on
everything, this was not an expenditure of funds and what happened in that meeting
that night was they asked for one streetlight because of extenuating circumstances and
Chairman Flora made the suggestion that if the Board is going to consider this, then the
Board will consider all that is on the list. There was no discussion, with regard to the
January 24, 2012 37
Vinton magisterial district; he did not know where they were until later when the Clerk
advised they were in the Vinton District. It was really a discussion over one and then
the discussion went to if you do for one you do for all; no matter what district it is in.
Supervisor Altizer stated he thinks the Board does these things to help our citizens and
a lot of the work is voted on in work session. He added that to insinuate anything was
inappropriate; he would have to say that absolutely was not the case.
Supervisor Church commented he had two clarifications. First, to
Supervisor Altizer he was not saying this was inappropriate; he was only talking to Mr.
Mahoney only to ask when the Board makes appropriations a lot of times we will hear a
request. There was nothing inappropriate done in his opinion, except he thinks the
opening and closing of the moratorium in work session is his only sticking point as he
does not think that is the appropriate place. A streetlight may not seem too important to
you, but trust me, we have had some street fights over requests in his area. It is a
highly volatile issue sometimes depending upon where the request is. In his opinion
the Board should not open a moratorium and close it. Secondly, with all due respect to
Ms. Moore, she was not denied a time to hear this at our December 13, 2011, meeting.
The Board was walking out of the room. There was no denial by anyone in our
December 13, 2011, meeting, there was just not enough time and asked Mr. Goodman
to verify. Mr. Goodman advised the Board was under time pressure issue. Supervisor
Church stated his request is to do the same for everybody. He does not think the Board
is doing the right thing by opening a moratorium and closing it; that is bad news period
in his opinion. The Board needs to be open and totally open. He reiterated he is not
accusing anybody of inappropriateness, just the fact that it does not show an open and
transparent decision or consensus making when the Board opens and close a
moratorium.
Chairman Flora inquired how did this moratorium come to be; did this
Board actually vote to put on the moratorium. Mr. Goodman explained the Board did
not vote on it, it was implemented by Staff because of budgetary concerns. Supervisor
Flora reiterated so the Board has never voted to institute a moratorium with Mr.
Goodman responding in the affirmative. Chairman Flora then asked Mr. Mahoney that
Mr. Church has asked a question about whether or not any actions have been taken on
this; is it because it is only on there for discussion. Mr. Mahoney responded there are
several issues. Mr. Mahoney stated he had viewed this matter since the Board had
never voted one way or the other on this. The Board gives direction to staff on a whole
variety of issues. Many times the Board gives staff direction in work session and the
staff goes out and does it. As an administrative matter, he thinks this is something that
is within this department in terms of handling these kinds of projects. Many years ago,
the Board had agreed to establish some neutral engineering, public safety criteria to
determine whether or not a streetlight would be installed and paid for the County or not;
which has been ongoing for a long period of time. He stated he never saw this as
requiring a vote by the Board but rather he saw it as the Board giving direction to staff in
order to implement existing policy. The Board has appropriated funds to the general
fund and within the general fund each department is obligated to fulfill the direction of
38 January 24, 2012
the Board whether through County Code or County policy. He advised he is sure if you
look at Mr. Covey's budget, there are numerous stormwater projects and the Board has
a very lengthy list of stormwater projects; not all of those are funded, but as funding
comes along those different projects move up the list and those projects are constructed
or resolved. He states this is the same, if it is the Board's direction to reallocate funds
within an existing budget that is what staff does. If it is the Board's pleasure to vote on
it, there are many instances where staff takes the lead from the Board's discussion
where many times a vote is not necessary. Chairman Flora stated his understanding is
the status is at the work session, the Board may by consensus say go ahead with the
ones approved and that has been set into motion. Mr. Mahoney responded in the
affirmative and as he understood from the discussion at the last meeting, the
applications that were pending all satisfied the mutual public safety and engineering
criteria; to that extent they were only not funded because funds allocated to that project
had run out and asked Mr. Covey to confirm. Mr. Covey advised staff evaluated those
and seven (7) out of the list were approved and are currently on hold until the Board
advises them to move forward. Additionally, there was one more that came in that was
evaluated that qualified as well.
Supervisor Church stated that is why the agenda item is for discussion.
He fully understood that staff does makes these decisions, but he was only talking
about the moratorium being lifted and being closed. He stated he thought that should
be in the public view and that was his entire reason for asking for this.
Chairman Flora stated his reason for asking questions is just for
clarification because he thinks there may have been a perception out there that this
Board actually initiated the moratorium two years ago and then took it off in work
session; that is not the case. He stated he fully understands the issue of fairness and
he does agree with it, but what he would suggest is that the Board does need a work
session on this very item and suggested that due to the fairly brief agenda this
afternoon, and there is only one item on the work session before the 7:00 p.m. meeting.
Does the Board want to discuss this item this evening in work session so the Board can
move ahead with this?
Chairman Flora stated he was not talking about making a decision; it
needs to be discussed how staff moves ahead with the seven (7) already approved, do
we want to leave it open for a while and allow people to make applications and let the
staff analyze it and then revisit in thirty days? Chairman Flora stated this item would be
moved to the work session. He stated he did not remember the Board opening and
closing it quite that abruptly, but the Board can discuss that more at work session.
Supervisor Church reiterated it was.
Chairman Flora stated at least that is someone's perception.
Supervisor Church responded the room is audio recorded, and is not a
perception it is a fact. It was opened and then closed because "if we make it public,
there will be twenty -five (25) more."
Chairman Flora stated it was how you remember the discussion as to
whether or not you think it was opened and closed.
January 24, 2012 39
IN RE: APPOINTMENTS
1. Building Code Board of Adjustments and Appeals (Fire Code
Board of Appeal s)(appointed at large)
At the request of the Board, Mr. Fields has been contacted to see if he is
willing to serve an additional term. Mr. Fields has expressed his willingness to serve an
additional term, which will expire on January 24, 2016. Confirmation has been placed
on the Consent Agenda.
2. Roanoke County Community Leaders Environmental Action
Roundtable (RCCLEAR)
Supervisor Moore has recommended the reappointment of Gene Marrano
to represent the Cave Spring District for an additional three -year term. Mr. Marrano's
term will expire on August 31, 2015. Confirmation has been placed on the Consent
Agenda.
IN RE: CONSENT AGENDA
RESOLUTION 012412 -3 APPROVING AND CONCURRING IN
CERTAIN ITEMS SET FORTH ON THE BOARD OF
SUPERVISORS AGENDA FOR THIS DATE DESIGNATED AS
ITEM H - CONSENT AGENDA
BE IT RESOLVED by the Board of Supervisors of Roanoke County, Virginia, as
follows:
That the certain section of the agenda of the Board of Supervisors for January
24, 2012, designated as Item H - Consent Agenda be, and hereby is, approved and
concurred in as to each item separately set forth in said section designated Items 1
through 2 inclusive, as follows:
1. Confirmation of appointment to the Building Code Board of Adjustments and
Appeals (Fire Code Board of Appeals); Ninth District Development Financing,
Inc.; Roanoke County Community Leaders Environmental Action Roundtable
(RCCLEAR); Roanoke County Planning Commission
2. Resolution expressing the appreciation of the Board of Supervisors of
Roanoke County to Jane D. Olsen, Library Assistant, upon her retirement
after more than twenty -one (21) years of service
On motion of Supervisor Altizer to adopt the resolution, and carried by the
following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
40 January 24, 2012
NAYS: None
A- 012412 -3.a
RESOLUTION 012412 -3.b EXPRESSING THE APPRECIATION
OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OF ROANOKE COUNTY
TO JANE D. OLSEN, LIBRARY SERVICES, UPON HER
RETIREMENT AFTER TWENTY -ONE (21) YEARS OF SERVICE
WHEREAS, Jane D. Olsen was first employed by Roanoke County on
September 17, 1990, by Library Services; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Olsen retired from Roanoke County on December 31, 2011, as
Library Assistant in Technical Services, after twenty -one years and three months of
service; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Olsen was first a member of the Children's Services staff,
providing story times, special programs and literacy activities for the children at the
Hollins and Glenvar libraries; and
WHEREAS, she opened the world of reading and imagination to children who
came to the library for story times; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Olsen later transferred to Technical Services, where she
assumed responsibility for receiving and processing all new items purchased for the
library system; and
WHEREAS, during her tenure in Technical Services, Ms.Olsen promptly and
efficiently processed hundreds of thousands of books and other materials, making them
readily available to library patrons throughout the valley; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Olsen also continuously sought to improve processes in her
department, resulting in greater efficiencies and appreciable cost savings; and
WHEREAS, Ms. Olsen has been a treasured colleague and valued friend and,
WHEREAS, through her employment with Roanoke County, Ms. Olsen has been
instrumental in improving the quality of life for its citizens.
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that the Board of Supervisors of
Roanoke County expresses its deepest appreciation and the appreciation of the citizens
of Roanoke County to JANE D. OLSEN for twenty -one (21) years of capable, loyal and
dedicated service to Roanoke County; and
FURTHER, the Board of Supervisors does express its best wishes for a happy
and productive retirement. On motion of Supervisor Altizer to adopt the resolution, and
carried by the following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
NAYS: None
January 24, 2012 41
IN RE: CITIZENS' COMMENTS AND COMMUNICATIONS
Chairman Flora asked the speakers signed up to speak at this session
and again at this evening's session limit their comments to one or the other.
The following citizens spoke:
Mr. Noah Tickle of 1603 Frost lane in Salem stated the plot of the United
Nations Socialist Agenda 21, ICLEI, The International Council of Local Environmental
Initiatives has now been brought out into the light of day for all to see. Our County
bought into this many years ago and has been paying them to implement their Trojan
horse of deceit. Under the guise of "Socialist- minded Climate research" and preaching
that, "food crops loving Co2" is bad. They claim to stand at a crossroads. That means
they now believe they have us deceived. This means that a lot of these research
scientists are standing at the crossroads, holding out paper bags like trick -or- treaters on
Halloween night, standing in line for taxpayer money to fill 'em up. Not only that but they
lay the ground work for Big Government to take your real estate and force "We The
People" into tightly quartered Urban Development Areas. These specialists in
shakedown "science," who speak only in fuzzy language and math, Chicken Little /the
sky is falling are pecking out the weather these days is the worst in history, or at least in
memory, or maybe a decade, and say they could -auh /would -auh have found useful links
between disasters and global- warming science by now if only they could shake down
tightwad taxpayers for a few more millions. This is real serious deception, folks; ICLEI
must go and he is serious. Their fuzzy language claims that man has never been so
badly abused by the weather, and that man himself has asked for it with his wild and
wicked ways abusing nature. The facts are not that, the "weather" has been wild and
wicked for many millennia before this one, when there were not nearly so many of us
stalking the planet for opportunities to make mischief. Folks this is the "Trojan Horse" of
ICLEI deceit. Anyone can see this is unbelievable nonsense, ICLEI must go.
Mr. Ernie Ragland of 555 North Dry Well Road in Natural Bridge Virginia
stated he would like to briefly mention his letter provided to the Board, which is an
update to his prior letter when he met here on January 20, 2012, bringing forward to the
notable bills coming up in the Virginia General Assembly. One of the things he has
learned since his statement there is another bill, House Bill 5 on the proposed
constitutional amendment dealing with eminent domain and redefining it for public use
only. It will be on the ballot in November if this General Assembly approves it. Another
is House Bill 92 relating to Urban Development areas and he is only going to mention
that there are other bills, House Bills 729, 794 869 and two Senate Bill, Senate bills 274
and 291 and the public is welcome to read those and he has provided the detail
transcripts of the bills, most of those which will make Urban Development Areas
optional and thinks the General Assembly will approve this in this session.
Mr. Bill Gregory deferred his comments until the 7:00 p.m. session.
Mr. Max Beyer of 2402 Coachman Drive in Roanoke stated he would like
to respond to the County Administrator comments as contained in the extended agenda,
which were made in support of continuing membership in ICLEI. This is what he will be
42 January 24, 2012
giving you tonight. Number one, the dues for the calendar year 2012 for membership
have already been paid. He would like to know when this occurred. If occurred within
the past two months, why was this done during the period that the staff knew that many
citizens were objecting to that action. Was this action taken with the knowledge and
approval of the Board? Number two, the thrust of the staff review insinuates that the
County's support of environmental stewardship is contingent upon membership in
ICLEI. If the County is not associated with ICLEI, the County is somehow not
environmentally friendly, which in his opinion is patently false. Responsible
environmental actions can and have been taken by the County without regard to any
ICLEI sponsored procedures, policies and jargon. The County can do this job without
ICLEI. Third, the progress and success provided by the staff recounted the County's
accomplishments during the past twelve (12) years cannot be attributed to ICLEI.
These were and can be continued to be done without association with ICLEI or
RCCLEAR. Fourth, exclusive use of ICLEI software is not essential to prudent
managing of the County's environmental program. There are many other less intrusive
resources available for managing the County's environmental programs. Fifth,
participation in ICLEI's programs and policies and jargon is voluntary, however, non -
participation today in a given area does not preclude the County from expanded
participation to more controversial areas. This is especially true since the staff is a
strong advocate for ICLEI and its tools and can be expected to recommend additions
often to the Board. Sixth, by its own admission, the staff advocates membership as a
symbol of the County's commitment to environmental stewardship. This is irrespective
of the actual and potential damage and cost the membership implies. In conclusion,
membership in ICLEI is a staff - sponsored action which is solely for the benefit of the
staff and it is not in the best interest of the County citizens. Instead, he would challenge
the Board to provide a positive recognition instead of private property rights and free
enterprise by withdrawing from ICLEI USA.
IN RE: REPORTS
Supervisor Church moved to receive and file the following reports. The
motion carried by the following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
NAYS: None
1. General Fund Unappropriated Balance
2. Capital Reserves
3. Reserve for Board Contingency
January 24, 2012 43
4. Treasurer's Statement of Accountability per Investment and
Portfolio Policy as of December 31, 2011
5. Report of Claims Activity for the Self- Insurance Program
6. Statement of Budgeted and Actual Revenues as of December 31,
2011
7. Statement of Budgeted and Actual Expenditures and
Encumbrances as of December 31, 2011
8. Accounts Paid — December 2011
9. Quarterly Report — Community Development Activities
IN RE: WORK SESSIONS
1. Work session to discuss fiscal year 2012 -2013 budget
development (B. Clayton Goodman III, County Administrator; W.
Brent Robertson, Director of Management and Budget)
The work session was held from 4:39 p.m. until 5:03 p.m.
Mr. Robertson reviewed the worksheets provided to the Board in the
agenda information.
Supervisor Church inquired as to the status of the school side. Mr.
Goodman responded there would be a joint meeting on February 1, 2012, and are
currently pulling information together to present to the School Board meeting on
January 26, 2012. He advised VRS would be the largest impact item.
Supervisor Elswick advised the year -to -date expenditures were at forty -
five percent (45 %) and does staff expect to see the same for the second half of the
year. Mr. Robertson advised some of these were seasonal expenditures. He indicated
the County was at the same place last year, but does not expect to see a ten percent
(10 %) savings. Mr. Goodman indicated he thought there might be some issues on fuel;
there is $200,000 in fuel contingency.
Supervisor Church asked if the fuel contingency fund was $200,000 or
$300,000 with Mr. Goodman responding $200, 000 and stating this has not yet been
spent.
Supervisor Church then inquired of Rebecca Owens, Director of Finance
what the status was with regard to health care with Ms. Owens responding they will
have a renewal rate by the end of January and will provide a fairly detailed presentation
at the February 1 St joint meeting.
44 January 24, 2012
Mr. Robertson then advised each department is working on their individual
budgets and he should have by the end of the week. He also stated staff is looking at a
slightly better outlook than a month ago on the revenue side.
Supervisor Church asked Mr. Goodman what operation costs are being
reviewed. Mr. Goodman responded it is going to be hard to do with no layoffs and no
reduction in services. He advised overall it is going to be a challenging budget year and
anticipates greater and more work sessions with the Board. He also advised that he
feels employees have done a good job over the last few years and is seeking a salary
increase as he feels the Board needs to recognize what the employees have done.
Supervisor Altizer stated he would like to request a work session at the
second meeting in February to have staff provide all surplus properties, land and lots.
2. Work session to discuss the moratorium on streetlights (B.
Clayton Goodman III, County Administrator)
The work session was held from 5:03 p.m. until 5:23 p.m.
Mr. Arnold Covey, Director of Community Services, provided the Board
members with the same information from the December 13, 2011 meeting, plus one
more request. Supervisor Altizer asked if the turnaround time was approximately one
week with Mr. Covey stating it depends because they could get hung up with the Police
Department. He advised that one person, Brian Epperly, has been assigned to work on
these directly with AEP.
Chairman Flora inquired if the policy needs to be reviewed. Mr. Covey
responded he thought they should go ahead with the current policy on the existing
requests and then review again at a later time
Supervisor Elswick advised he did not realize that other people would
want lights and advocated opening it up for a month.
Supervisor Church indicated if the moratorium is lifted and are approved
they need to be done, however, what if they need a pole, what is the cost with Mr.
Covey responding $2,500 to $3,500.
Supervisor Elswick suggested if a pole is needed, then the request should
not be completed.
Supervisor Altizer asked prior to the moratorium what the average street
light addition cost per year with Mr. Covey advising he did not have that information.
Supervisor Altizer then asked how long the County has been doing streetlights with Mr.
Covey responding since 1986, however, there is no County ordinance or regulation that
stated the County is responsible for street lights, but has been doing these based on the
criteria of motorist safety. Supervisor Altizer then asked how many were on the County
books with Mr. Covey responding 1,495. Supervisor Altizer then asked the annual cost
with Mr. Covey responding $128,000.
Supervisor Church stated he believes a month is too short a period of time
for a trial and would suggest a trial for ninety days.
Supervisor Altizer asked if the citizens have been told these streetlights
January 24, 2012 45
have been approved with Mr. Covey responding in the affirmative. Supervisor Altizer
stated if these citizens have already been notified, then it should be done. He
suggested putting another $500 out of Board Contingency Fund to cover until the
budget process has been completed.
Mr. Covey suggested they do the evaluation process and then pay for
wherever the electricity is paid stating the electric bill is always going to get paid.
Supervisor Church stated he agrees.
Supervisor Altizer stated he thinks that staff should go forward on the ones
where the poles are already in place and take the funds out of the contingency fund.
Supervisor Church stated he believes they should open the moratorium for
ninety days and see what comes in.
Supervisor Elswick suggested the citizen pay for the pole themselves.
Chairman Flora stated the Board opened the door and in all fairness if
comes in within the next ninety (90) days and meets the criteria he feels it should be
installed.
It was the consensus of the Board to open the moratorium on streetlights
for ninety (90) days and if they meet the criteria, they will be installed and the Board will
decide at that point how best to move forward.
At 7:00 p.m., Chairman Flora moved to return to open session. Chairman
Flora then moved the agenda items for the Glenvar Community Plan and the
Stormwater ordinance ahead of the discussion on ICLEI due to the number of citizens
signed up to speak. There were no objections.
IN RE: PUBLIC HEARINGS AND ADOPTION OF RESOLUTION
1. Public hearing and resolution to amend the Roanoke County
Comprehensive Plan to include the Glenvar Community Plan
(Amanda Micklow, Planner II)
Amanda Micklow outlined the resolution to amend the comp plan to
include the Glenvar Community Plan. Several focus group members were in the
audience as acknowledged by Amanda.
Supervisor Church asked the focus group members to stand and be
recognized.
Chairman Flora explained that this plan was discussed in length at a work
session held at the January 10, 2012 meeting and that was why there were no
questions at this meeting.
RESOLUTION 012412 -4 APPROVING AND ADOPTING AN
AMENDMENT TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN FOR
ROANOKE COUNTY, VIRGINIA, INCORPORATING THE
GLENVAR COMMUNITY PLAN
46 January 24, 2012
WHEREAS, on November 14, 2011, the Planning Commission held a public
hearing on an amendment to the Comprehensive Plan incorporating the Glenvar
Community Plan, after advertisement and notice as required by Section 15.2 -2204 of
the Code of Virginia; and
WHEREAS, on January 24, 2012, the Board of Supervisors held a public
hearing on an amendment to the Comprehensive Plan incorporating the Glenvar
Community Plan, after advertisement and notice as required by Section 15.2 -2204 of
the Code of Virginia; and
WHEREAS, Roanoke County, Virginia, has a long and successful history of
community planning that has emphasized citizen involvement and participation; and
WHEREAS, Section 15.2 -2223 of the Code of Virginia requires that the Planning
Commission of every jurisdiction shall prepare and recommend a comprehensive plan
for the physical development of their jurisdiction; and
WHEREAS, the Planning Commission has reviewed and recommended an
amendment to the Comprehensive Plan for Roanoke County entitled "Glenvar
Community Plan" and said plan has been prepared in accordance with Sections 15.2-
2223, 2224, and 2229 of the Code of Virginia.
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED by the Board of Supervisors of Roanoke
County, Virginia, as follows:
1. That the Comprehensive Plan is hereby amended by the adoption of the
Glenvar Community Plan, with the recommended "housekeeping changes" to the Future
Land Use Map as well as the Land Use Map changes for West Main Street and the
Dixie Caverns area as recommended by the Glenvar Focus Group and Planning
Commission.
2. That this Resolution is effective from and after its adoption.
On motion of Supervisor Church to adopt the resolution, and carried by the
following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Church, Elswick, Flora
NAYS: None
IN RE: SECOND READING OF ORDINANCES
1. Ordinance amending Section 23 -3.4. "Stormwater management
facility maintenance agreements" of Chapter 23. "Stormwater
Management" of the Roanoke County Code (Paul M. Mahoney,
County Attorney)
Mr. Mahoney outlined the ordinance which included additional obligations
with respect to stormwater management facilities. He explained after the first reading,
staff met with the Homebuilders Association. The Homebuilders Association prepared a
response which essentially stated basically to continue to do what has been done in the
January 24, 2012 47
past, but add an additional County inspection. He advised that staff feels this will not
solve the problem. Staff has met with all of the various citizen and homeowners
associations for each district with the exception of Catawba, which will be held next
Monday.
Supervisor Elswick inquired if the bond would apply only to new
developments or could it also be retroactive to the developments that have been
started, but not completed. Mr. Mahoney responded in the negative stating he believes
if the Board adopts this ordinance amendment, it can only be applied to new
developments that come in for approval.
The following citizens spoke:
Mr. Peter Fields of 6416 North Barrens Road in Roanoke stated he has
been building and developing in the County for approximately ten (10) years and has
probably done seven (7) or eight (8) developments, all of which have stormwater ponds.
He stated he remembered selling real estate in the 1970s; a contract was one page. A
person went to closing, signed their name three or four times and you bought a house.
Today, there are ten pages of contract documents to sign to buy a house, you go to an
attorney's office to close, he has a stack of papers that would choke a horse that you
have to sign, 150 times. Parts of those documents are the Homeowners Association
Packet (HOA) that includes the Bylaws, Covenants and Restrictions. They also include
a budget and that budget is designed to show what the liabilities of the Association are
as well as the dues structure that is going to collect the money that is going to support
those responsibilities. The Homeowners Association also has to be formed as a
corporation, have a tax identification number; it has to have a checking account in order
to collect those dues. So from the time the very first lot is sold, that Homeowners
Association is in place. The Homeowners Association has the responsibility at that time
of maintaining these detention ponds. The developer maintains a fifty -one percent
(51 %) voting interest to protect their interest in the subdivision so that the Association,
whether is being managed by the developer or by a Board of Directors cannot adopt
laws that would adversely effect the developer's ability to sell lots, or build houses in his
communities. If the Homeowner's Association is fully formed at the time the first lot is
developed and it is collecting dues, it should have assets. If there is any failure on the
part of the developer, it would be underestimating what the value of the expenses are
and therefore underestimating what the dues structure should be and he thinks that is
something that leads to assessments on the homeowners which can happen from time
to time. Hopefully for our business, we try to prepare those budgets so they accurately
reflect what the liabilities and responsibilities are going to be. Mr. Mahoney also
intimated that the Homebuilders Association asked for inspections, which is not the
case. The County has adopted an inspection procedure to inspect ponds biannually
and by doing so, we feel that the likelihood of having continued maintenance problems
with ponds is going to be drastically reduced because every two (2) years you are going
to get a letter from the County saying your pond is deficient in these areas or it is not. In
a two (2) year period, he thinks it is difficult to think that a detention pond could be
drastically out of whack where more than a few hundred dollars would not correct the
48 January 24, 2012
problems. He stated he knows the problems that Mr. Mahoney is referring to are from
ponds that have not been maintained for ten, fifteen, twenty years and just as he has
stated, the current regulations are driving the need to be looking after these ponds a
little more proactively than in the past. It is still not something that we can correct with
an ordinance going forward. We cannot correct what has happened in the past with an
ordinance going forward, but we strongly feel that the two (2) year biannual inspection
of ponds is going to mitigate some of the more extreme defective ponds and the
expense to correct them.
Supervisor Church stated he is a believer that communication in this
process is inadequate. He is not trying to say it is from the developer or from the
homeowner, but somewhere along the line he believes over fifty percent (50 %) of these
problems could be hopefully mitigated or eliminated. His initial suggestion would be to
devise a process at the attorney's office to pull this out the necessary information, tag it,
highlight it, emphasis it, have the new homeowner sign it acknowledging they have read
it or looked at it because there is a problem. He indicated when talking about
stormwater management detention ponds, some contain trees four feet thick. He stated
he hopes some are as Mr. Fields stated and three or four hundred dollars could clear it
out, maybe a group of neighbors can do this, but too many times the process has failed.
Supervisor Church then asked Mr. Fields what suggestions would he have as a
developer regarding HOAs and citizens who find out ten years after they have been in a
subdivision.
Mr. Fields responded to Supervisor Church by stating ten years ago,
detention ponds were not given a second look, it was something that was "over there"
that nobody ever paid any attention to because nobody had to. Roanoke County was
not doing any inspections. It would be hard for him as a developer to go to his
homeowners and say, "well we have to maintain this pond, mow it, trim the trees out of
it and they are sitting there stating, "Who cares about that pond, the water is still going
through it like it is supposed to." So, it is very difficult for him as a developer to be
spending their money, which it is their money, because the Homeowners Association
already exists and is collecting dues and is already an entity that has the responsibility
of maintaining that pond. He cannot speak to what has happened fifteen to twenty
years ago and if you have a four -foot tree in the pond then that pond was constructed at
least twenty years ago.
Supervisor Church stated it was just an illustration.
Mr. Fields stated some of the ponds that have the most problems are the
ones that were done the longest time ago and they have not been inspected until the
past couple of years. It has only been in the past couple of years that the County has
been doing any detention pond inspections. He stated the developers support these
inspections; think they are great. He would love it if he is still managing the Association,
which he does for the first few years until they get a large enough group of homeowners
to elect a Board of Directors among them to then take over the day to day operations. If
he is managing this Association and gets a letter from Roanoke County that says you
need to do the following things to your pond, the Homeowners have really very little
January 24, 2012 49
argument with me about whether he is foolishly spending their money to maintain a
pond that nobody cares about.
Supervisor Church stated his point is we need to educate our
homeowners early in the process.
Mr. Fields stated he had suggested the County attending some of the
Association meetings. Usually there is an annual meeting of the Association and would
hate to have the County come to a meeting if there is only three (3) homeowners, but at
some point there is going be enough homeowners there to make a difference and
usually that is once. For instance, as a developer he can say we have enough people
and we want a Board of Directors that is made up of the homeowners but can now
manage the association. That does not mean he has relinquished his voting authority
so he could be "in control" of the Association, but this does not mean he is managing
the Association.
Supervisor Elswick stated his question is for Mr. Mahoney or Mr.
Goodman. It sounds like we have a good ordinance going forward, but if ten (10) years
ago there was a pond there and the Association knew about it, knew they had the
responsibility for the pond why did Roanoke County not inspect it. Has it been ten (10)
years not being inspected or is it a new requirement from the Federal government?
How come it was not inspected and the Association notified ten (10) years ago.
Mr. Goodman stated the County did not put the funds into hiring the
inspectors, etc. until approximately three (3) years ago, when they became more aware
of the need to do these types of inspections. It was late and a better job could have
been done and are now attempting to catch up trying to be prepared for the new
stormwater regulations that will be coming in 2014.
Supervisor Altizer commented the Board cannot do anything about the
past, but the past is an indicator of the future as some percentage. He stated he had
been involved because of three subdivisions, took ten years to develop and he knows
the problems and he knows when everything works perfectly and it does work perfectly
for the ninety percent (90 %) of the people that build homes. His concern and his
suggestions are for instances with HOA's with a pond and no money, the developer
underestimated and there was no formidable process of notifying the homeowners.
He advised he and Roanoke County do not want to impose more imposition on
developers, but there is a certain amount of protection that is necessary with the HOA's
not being treated right. He stated he thinks it is a low percentage, but it does happen.
In talking with Mr. Mahoney and Mr. Covey, he would like to suggest the Board put off a
decision on this until the next meeting to enable staff to go back to the homebuilders.
Some of things he would like to see in the ordinance is in reference to the meeting that
would go on with an HOA, would not be a regular meeting of the HOA, but a meeting
with the HOA and the developers and somebody from Roanoke County staff when the
developer is prepared to turn that pond over, just so the County can reiterate, you have
all the information and from this day forward you take over this pond and eliminates all
the discussion of whomever read their HOA packets, who did not understand what they
were buying. It is good for the developer that the County is involved and going out and
50 January 24, 2012
making the HOA aware and it is coming from the County and not the developer of what
they are going to have to do and what they are responsible for. He indicated we should
have something like that in the ordinance that we would have notifications, i.e. ten (10)
business days prior to that meeting between the developer. In lieu of a bond,
Supervisor Altizer stated he believes Roanoke County has to have some security,
because some developer is not going to do what ninety to ninety -five percent (90 to
95 %) of the other developers do. He cited an experience he had with Fallen Creek
whereby he asked for a personal guarantee, with no money upfront, no money to pay
with the understanding if the pond is not maintained, either personally or through your
company they would need to pay for it. He stated he is trying to provide options and not
to affect added costs to homes in this Valley or artificially raising them, anytime the
County raises a price to developers, they are artificially inflating the price of new houses
and when staff does an assessment, part of the assessment is based on what the cost
of new housing is. He asked Mr. Fields to consider these things or bring up other things
that they believe would be a way the County can protect its citizens; the developers can
protect themselves and come up with a way the developers will not have to outlay more
money. He stated he believes this Board wants to work with the developers, he just
offers this as a suggestion as some language and to go back and talk to the developers
again and bring it back at the first meeting in February.
Chairman Flora asked Mr. Mahoney if there was a way that a person can
give their own personal guarantee and the County is covered.
Mr. Mahoney responded he thinks it would be an alternative form of
security. Staff implemented a similar approach in the Wolf Creek situation with a
personal guarantee coupled with a corporate guarantee. He advised he has never had
to pursue or collect on that personal guarantee because the developers did fulfill their
responsibilities and obligation to maintain that pond so that it met all standards. He
stated Supervisor Altizer is suggesting just a different form of security and he thinks with
a personal or individual signoff by the developer it gives us one more avenue for
enforcement. In any situation, parties can bankrupt out but there is always that risk.
Supervisor Altizer moved to table this item until February 28, 2012, and
include the items discussed in the ordinance and anything else that staff or the
developers may come up with. All supervisors voted in agreement.
Chairman Flora stated he wanted to make sure that the Board is not
putting a great deal of burden on the County because right now there is not a lot of
development going on and there is time for staff to be out doing a lot inspections. When
the economy picks back up, he does not want to hear us say that five or six people
need to be hired to do these inspections. When looking at this ordinance, just make
sure you do not overburden the staff. This should be an issue when they sign the
documents, it should be a done deal.
IN RE: NEW BUSINESS
1. Discussion of membership in ICLEI — Local Governments for
January 24, 2012 51
Sustainability (Anne Marie Green, Director of General Services)
The following citizens spoke.
Bill Gregory of 3312 Pamlico Drive, Roanoke, Virginia stated he has been
a County resident for nineteen (19) years. He stated Supervisor Moore was interviewed
by Dan Casey, as part of his January 8 Roanoke Times Articles titled Tea party
steaming as before on ICLEI. One sentence in the article attempted to get to the crux of
why the County is a member of ICLEI. Mr. Casey quotes "ICLEI provides the County
with energy and pollution- auditing software that Moore estimated would cost tax payers'
$30,000 if the County bought its own." He stated he is speaking as a concerned County
resident today and is in no way speaking on behalf of the company he works for on this
matter. He advised he is a mechanical engineer and performs building energy analysis
for the past twenty (20) years for facilities across the County as part of my job
description. Residential, commercial and governmental buildings in the County likely
represent the largest chunk of energy usage within the County. He asked to focus on
that one particular large aspect of the County's total energy use. If Roanoke County
wants to perform energy analysis of their County -owned buildings and facilities or any
buildings in the County, or it could purchase building energy analysis software from
Trane, Carrier or the like and have Dr. McGinnis and RVCCC partner with the County or
somebody to perform the building energy analysis and life- cycle, cost analysis on
various buildings. The results from these readily available energy analysis programs
from Trane, Carrier, or the like can also led to energy analysis, recommendations about
how county governments, businesses and homeowners can save money on energy for
their buildings. The Trane Building Energy Analysis software called Trace 700 can be
purchased from Trane for $2,000 for a single site license; the Trane Trade 700 Building
Energy Analysis Program has been validated by thousands of consulting engineers
across the country. Trane and Carrier are building energy analysis software is
constantly improving in real time as they work out bugs revealed by both themselves
and the customers. They have full -time staff purely devoted to working out these issues
with these programs. How does ICLEI software compare to that level of validation and
bug resolution? He stated he understands the County believes it needs the pollution
auditing portion of this ICLEI software to audit the County's emissions to determine if
the County is on track to meet the three percent (3 %) reduction per year. That portion
of the ICLEI software is totally unnecessary. The amount of CO2 the County emits is a
miniscule fraction of a percent of the global, manmade and naturally occurring CO2
emissions. This amount should not warrant the effort to audit the County's CO2
emissions so why is Roanoke County so adamantly concerned about its contribution
manmade CO2 emissions when it is such a negligible contribution when compared to all
sources of CO2 emissions.
Brian Lang of 6752 Quail Place, Roanoke, Virginia stated he has been a
County resident for nearly twenty (20) years. Mr. Lang stated it is his understanding that
Roanoke County only spends about $1,200 per year on its ICLEI membership and as a
fraction of the County budget it is so miniscule that he does not think the price of it
52 January 24, 2012
actually is a consideration here. It is really what does it symbolize and what does the
County get out of it. He advised we have all heard a lot of hysterical, overreactions that
the United Nations are trying to take over Roanoke County through ICLEI and he would
like to point out some of the non - controversial things the United Nations have done that
ICLEI should be viewed in the same light. For example, many decades ago Americans
were terrified of contracting polio and the United Nations participated in a world -wide
vaccine program which has nearly eradicated polio. We do not even worry about polio
anymore and he does not think there is a single person who would say that is part of a
United Nations conspiracy to take over the United States; and the same thing goes with
ICLEI. It is independent of the United Nations; they support it. It does a lot of good
things, helping people save energy which just like the polio eradication programs of
decades ago will provide benefits for many, many decades, many generations to come.
So, he urged the Board to resist the pressure from the "fringe element" who would
mischaracterize membership as participating in a United Nations conspiracy and make
a more mature decision based on looking at things that are going to impact Roanoke
County citizens for those many generations to come. Maintain that ICLEI membership
and make the most of it.
Adam Cohen of 5104 Bernard Drive in Roanoke, Virginia 24018 asked if
he could take sixty (60) seconds and give the Board a suggestion for stormwater. For
thirty years, he has been building in this County and 25 to 20 years ago he remembers
sitting at a job site with Marcus Brown and Will Simpson looking at a stormwater pond,
which had just been inspected during construction and saying as much as we inspect
these things as soon as they get turned over to the homeowners it does not matter
because everybody ignores them. It was clear as day, this is not a surprise.
Engineering, everybody knew this who was in the community knew this was coming.
So, as much similar to that situation, we all know what is coming down the road for our
children and our grandchildren as far as climate change. ICLEI membership is
symbolic. Roanoke County is not going to cut 15% of their carbon emissions in five (5)
years. He stated he is on Roanoke City's committee and they have committed to ten
percent (10 %) and they are not going to do that. It is pie in the sky to think that you can
go that with no budget and no policies and no carrots or sticks. So, the thing that
Roanoke County is doing by being in ICLEI is just a statement saying that Roanoke
County has some concerns about our future and about our children's future. The reality
is it is not going to get done, 15 percent (15 %) in five (5) years, the Board has
committed to something you cannot do because there are no teeth behind it and it takes
a lot more than that. The gentleman was correct, two percent (2 %) of Roanoke County
is County buildings; you can get rid of it because it is not going to make that much of a
difference, and it is not going to happen. So, maintain the membership with ICLEI if it
cost $1,200, it is worth it and what you have said is we do care about our children, we
have not put any money behind it. There is no money to put behind it. So, maybe it is
just symbolic, but I am glad it is there. As far as his suggestion, what is coming down
the road as a member of Clean Valley Council, stormwater is very, very important.
What is coming down the road with us is not the quantity issue that we got for ignoring
January 24, 2012 53
ten, 15, 20 years old ponds, it's quality issues where we have installed these filters that
require maintenance every year and they are taking transported solids and chemicals
out of stormwater, but what we need to do is have the certifying engineers on a yearly
basis go back and make sure that those filters have been cleaned and disposed of
properly, that they have been disposed of in a way that is not going harm the
environment because I can just pull the filter out and wash it out, what have I done,
have taken a year's worth of chemicals and washed it down the storm sewer. That is
not exactly right. So, we could not cost the County a cent, set up a data base and on a
yearly basis whether it is a commercial owner or a homeowners association, make the
engineer who designed the system certify that it has been done correctly, it will not cost
the County a cent and it will be real easy to put in the upfront agreements and we can
make sure the stuff is disposed of, disposed of correctly and the filters are maintained
and cleaned because right now there are filters that are over a year old just sitting there
and nobody is paying any attention to them.
Robert Crawford of 6620 Shingle Ridge Road in Roanoke County stated a small
organized group in our area vociferously opposes the ICLEI organization and Roanoke
County's ongoing association with it, despite the County's reports that the association is
highly beneficial to the county. ICLEI, the full name of which includes the subtitle 'Local
Governments for Sustainability' provides members a variety of assistance and support
to help them achieve sustainability in resource use. That support includes guidebooks,
training, software and peer networking across the country and farther, all of which ICLEI
members may use with no constraining conditions. What drives the opposition, one
finds in browsing their website, is a generalized fear that putting resource use on a
sustainable basis will result in loss of property rights. This opposition fits the template of
generalized opposition to the practice of zoning regulation, though zoning itself is not
prominent in their texts. The opposition group's fear of a loss or weakening of property
rights is linked to ICLEI, since the promotion of sustainability is ICLEI's objective. As
expressed in the opposition group's website, the focus of their opposition is on any effort
on the part of a local or other governmental unit to seek sustainability or practice
conservation or so- called green measures. A slogan of the group warns, "Beware the
green menace." The United Nations, it turns out, is seen as part of the menace, since
sustainability is, naturally, an important feature in various UN studies and initiatives
addressing world problems. Referring to a dictionary, we find that sustainability, as
related to natural resource use, is the maintenance of an ecological balance by avoiding
depletion of natural resources. Fishermen and hunters have always known that, for
example, if their habitat is not sustained, the fish or game populations will not be either.
Similar examples from every field could be given: the trucker who does not keep his
tires in serviceable condition, the pilot who does not maintain altitude, the musician who
stops rehearsing. Unsustainability of any process means loss, stoppage, failure or
death, depending on the process. For the benefit of present and future citizens,
Roanoke County should continue its valuable association with ICLEI. Thank you.
Janet Scheid of 1453 Wolf Creek Drive in Vinton, Virginia stated she is here this
afternoon to speak in support of the County's participation in the local governments for
54 January 24, 2012
sustainability otherwise known as ICLEI. This is a worldwide organization dedicated to
helping local governments generate public awareness of environmental and
sustainability issues. ICLEI is also providing technical assistance to help us achieve our
goals. When the Board voted in 2007 to become a member of ICLEI, the Board did so
unanimously and with a commitment to help your citizens deal with skyrocketing energy
costs. She stated she felt the need to speak to the Board today as an appointed
representative to RCCLEAR the citizen group that was created by the Board to promote
energy conservation and improve the valley's air quality. The path of RCCLEAR is to
develop a local action plan to reduce emissions and long -term energy costs by
developing strategies for improving energy efficiency and conservation. Despite what
the earlier speaker said, the Roanoke Valley was close to non - attainment of the ozone
standards set by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) which could have meant
fines and expensive retrofits for gas stations and industries. There was also a growing
prevalence of asthma and other breathing disorders here in the valley, which will be
helped by improved air quality. RCCLEAR will utilize ICLEI software and technical
assistance to measure our energy reduction and determine if we are meeting our goals.
The Board has heard in what her opinion unwarranted claims about ICLEI. Claims that
imply that it is some type of radical, maybe even subversive group. As an outcrop of
ICLEI, RCCLEAR is a group of Roanoke County citizens who were appointed by the
Board of Supervisors. They are volunteers who are willingly giving their time because
they believe energy reduction and energy conservation are important goals for Roanoke
County. The bottom line is that ICLEI and RCCLEAR are trying to save people money
by teaching people how to save energy. Roanoke County needs to remain in ICLEI so
that RCCLEAR can utilize their software and continue to be productive and Roanoke
County needs to continue to be an environmental leader.
Cher McCoy of 43 Passamaquoddy Trail in Lexington, Virginia in Rockbridge
County stated Thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight on this important subject.
ICLEI - the International Council for Local Environmental Initiatives. Roanoke became a
member in 2007, which means you've agreed to their principals and rules. I understand
why you would become a member. In 2007, "1" didn't know who ICLEI was nor had I had
any understanding of UN Agenda 21 - both of which have the same goals. What they
want to do should scare you. It does me. ICLEI is designed to start at the local level.
Get you hooked and then Agenda 21 takes over at a higher level. It's simple. They offer
you something small. It sounds good. Looks good on paper and in most instances it is
something most of us would want to have. In return, however, they take something
away. Something small, or is it? Your rights are being taken away. That's something no
American should have to give up. ICLEI isn't a Democratic or Republican problem.
ICLEI is an American problem and it starts with local government. As an example they
will suggest you replace a current electrical meter with a "smart" meter. They will tell
you all the great data that you'll get from this new meter. Such as, data that will be
helpful in cutting your your electrical costs. Sounds good, right? What they don't tell you
is their ultimate goal with these meters. Down the road they will use that data against
January 24, 2012 55
you. One day you'll be drying a load of clothes and all of a sudden the dryer stops, long
before the clothes are dry. To your horror you find that your "smart" meter turned it off.
And when you ask why they tell you that it's because you've used too much electricity.
The real job of the "smart" meter is to spy on you and control when you can and cannot
use electrical appliances. Here's another example of what's coming to a neighborhood
near you. Let's say you own a house in the county and have a well. One day, in the not
so distant future, you will be told that although you own the property (and by the way,
probably not for much longer) you don't own what is under the earth - the water. So,
then you will be taxed for your use of the water. This is all before you no longer can own
the property at all. They are working on how to take that away from you as we speak.
These are only small examples of the goals connected to ICLEI and Agenda 21. They
will continue to work on small issues with a give and take program they hope will appeal
to everyone while building up to major issues like taking your land ultimately becoming
global. They plan to legislate the regulation. Basically, your rights will be stripped one
by one. You will be herded like cattle from your country home to be put in a "Cottage"
community within the city limits where you will not need a car as you'll be within walking
distance to all you needs. They will then take over all the rural land. They will decide
how this land is to be used. There will be no lower, middle and upper class. Everyone
will be equal — literally and financially as they will redistribute the wealth. The "haves
will give to the have nots" and that is total control over our lives, folks; even to how
many children you can have. She stated she knows this sounds like a Stephen King
novel or a Sci -Fi movie, but this is real and it's happening now. If we don't stop ICLEI,
we are heading down a path of destruction for America. It's a progressive movement
done by those who are basically telling you that you cannot make these important
decisions for yourself. REALLY!? All of you should be angry and insulted because
ICLEI is insulting your intelligence as well as mine. They are saying we can't make
important decisions regarding our lives and our community! Of course we can. We the
People... elected all of you. The proper role of government is to protect equal rights —
not provide equal things. Life and liberty are securely only so long as the right of
property is secure.
Mary McCallum of 4824 Wade Road in Roanoke, Virginia and had lived there for
twenty -two (22) years. Ms. McCallum stated she has always been an environmentalist.
She has always felt that God's creation is so amazing it must be protected. She has
never been an environmental activist until lately. Suddenly she found in her 50's that
people would actually stand in the way of doing the right thing. She was amazed at this
sentiment. ICLEI stands for the "International Council for Local Environmental
Initiatives ". From their website it is: "A movement driving positive change on a global
scale through programs and campaigns on local sustainability. A resource center
offering information, tools, networking, training and consulting services." Participation in
any of its programs is voluntary! How can an organization that promotes sustainable
living and smart growth be a bad thing? Unsustainable living means we all die
56 January 24, 2012
prematurely. And there's no future for planet earth or for our children. It is clear to her
that sustainable living and sustainable development promote the American values of
stewardship, fairness to future generations, and opportunity for productive communities
where individuals and businesses strive for the common good. Good examples include
the Roanoke City Market, the Salem, Grandin Road and other local markets. They all
provide opportunity and outlets for local farmers and artisans. When we purchase local
items we are supporting sustainable living. Sustainable means balanced, maintainable,
justifiable, and viable among other things. It definitely is not some UN driven conspiracy
or some imagined threat to personal property rights. As a Roanoke county citizen,
support the county's continued participation in ICLEI and support Roanoke County
Community Leaders Environmental Action Roundtable (RCCLEAR) efforts to reduce
greenhouse gasses. She advised she works for a small business in Roanoke County
that is getting a free Energy Checkup through the efforts of RCCLEAR. This will improve
our bottom line by saving on electric bills and increase our sustainability by reducing our
carbon footprint and is a direct result of Roanoke County's participation in ICLEI.
Dan Crawford of 2311 Kipling Street, SW, in Roanoke City thanked the Board for
the opportunity to express his views. Tonight, we are fully aware of the fact that the
future of ourselves and our future generations are in your hands and only time will tell
the gravity of that statement. It is in time that we will know. Speaking of time, let's go
back ten (10) years and get a perspective of what time would mean. We can remember
ten (10) years ago. Ten (10) years ago most of us had a sense of how grave the
challenges were that faced us. We could see global warming happening. It was
happening for real; fossil fuel and our dependence upon it was posing dire problems if
not threats. Time, ten (10) years ago, most of us had not heard of ICLEI and did not
imagine we would be joining them. Ten (10) years ago we did not imagine that
Roanoke would be the likely home of Virginia's first commercial wind farm; knowing
today there are about 16,000 wind turbines in this country. Ten (10) years ago our
perspective was different, time changes things. Ten (10) years ago there had not been
a Katrina, gulf oil disaster or the monumental disaster with nuclear energy (the
Fukushima Disaster in Japan). A lot of things have happened that remind us that our
overdependence on fossil fuel poses some dire threats and serious challenges. There
are things the Board will have to face. Adding that up with the realization that 2011
brought to us, in his opinion, and most people agree, rapid climate change has brought
2011 the biggest, longest list of environmental disasters, weather driven disasters this
country has even faced. Disasters translating into billions and billions of dollars of
expense. Let's go forward ten years and image what we might be facing in ten years
from now. To him, the prospects are challenging, they are daunting. It is hard to image.
One thing we know, things are going to change and lot of the changes are going to be
very difficult to swallow. We will also note that there will be changes in technology; and
through wise involvement with ICLEI, we will gain access to global knowledge regarding
how to access the technology, how to use it. We will be able to interface with
January 24, 2012 57
technicians, scientists and those in the know worldwide and help us make better
decisions. ICLEI has already provided the County information that is translated into
thousands of dollars in electric bill savings and this will only continue and most likely
accelerate. He stated he greatly appreciated the Board's wise choice in being involved
in ICLEI and hope you surely stick with it.
Gregory Honeycutt of 4090 White Oak Drive in Salem, Virginia stated he is the
President of the Roanoke Tea Party and has been a resident of Roanoke County for
about twenty -five (25) years and a property owner and resident at 4090 White Oak
Drive in Salem, which is Roanoke County for about seven (7) of those years, the seven
(7) most recent. His prepared remarks opposing the County's membership in ICLEI
have been echoed already a couple of times today and over the course of the last few
months. The Board has been presented with an abundance of information supporting
our desire that the County discontinue this affiliation. Instead, he would like to use his
time this evening to relate a real -life, common -sense example of how energy saving
policies put forth by ICLEI inspired programs can serve to hinder one of the goals most
important to us all, that is saving money on power bills. Automatic light switches, we all
have had an experience with them, often in a Roanoke County -owned building. It
seems like a good idea and it is a good idea to a point. Lights going out automatically
are nothing revolutionary. There have been timers and things of that nature for some
time and it is advisable in some instances for example, exterior lighting, there is no point
in lighting the exterior of a building all night long for no one to see it. Including the cost
of hardware, the cost of installation and the hardware has to be maintained and none of
those are unacceptably expensive on a small scale. No one would argue with that he
thinks. Under guidelines set forth by organizations like ICLEI, building codes in the
County will begin to mandate these policies in construction, not just in County buildings.
These will be imposed on not only residential builders, but commercial builders as well.
From a common sense perspective, it occurs to him that when you walk into a
restaurant maybe those lights do not need to be on fifteen (15) minutes, maybe you just
needed a moment there and once you pass that sensor, those lights are going to stay
on for another 15 minutes. Gentlemen and lady of the Board, a simple post -it note or
adhesive label requesting, "Please turn off your lights when you leave" will suffice. Just
his opinion, this Board and by extension, residents of Roanoke County will be well
served by a complete re- evaluation of the supposed benefits of the affiliation with ICLEI.
Donna Baker of 6010 Wimbleton Court in Roanoke, Virginia has been a resident
of Roanoke County for eleven (11) years stated she supports the County's membership
to ICLEI. She stated she thinks Roanoke County will see a real benefit by belonging to
this organization. ICLEI provides a toolkit and guidelines in helping the County reduce
its negative impact on the environment in saving budget dollars on energy costs. The
County is free to choose to adopt any of the changes suggested by ICLEI. The cost of
ICLEI is $1,200 annually to Roanoke County and that works out to be less than one and
one -half (1 1 /) cents per resident. The investment of $1,200 is well worth it through the
realized savings by implementing some of the suggestions by ICLEI. She stated she
takes pride in the fact that Roanoke County is forward looking and making changes in
58 January 24, 2012
our community to help the local environment in reducing emissions and saving energy.
She is confident the majority of the residents who live in her neighbor and community
can definitely appreciate the value that our community derives from ICLEI membership.
She stated she encouraged the Board to make your decision to continue membership in
ICLEI. She asked that the Board make the decision based on fact, not fiction; truth not
misinformation.
Luke Baker of 6010 Wimbleton Court in Roanoke, Virginia and has been a
resident for eleven (11) years and is a sophomore at Hidden Valley High School and a
supporter of ICLEI. There are many things that ICLEI provides to Roanoke County,
provides them access to software and technical tools and assistance in guiding
communities to sustainability. ICLEI provides guidelines to local governments to
measure energy use and lower greenhouse gas emissions. With only a $1,200
membership fee, it provides a huge amount of information and tools and ways to help
Roanoke County have a better environment and be more cost effective and also it helps
save energy. He stated he knows his generation wants to have a better environment
and community and energy -smart for the years to come. With a membership of ICLEI,
he thinks Roanoke County takes the first step toward that goal. He stated he
encouraged the Board of Supervisors to continue Roanoke County's membership to
ICLEI.
Dan Babish lives in Fincastle in Botetourt County and stated in 2008 Roanoke
Cement sponsored the grant that enabled Roanoke County to measure its
environmental impact on the area. Roanoke Cement has a long term commitment to
energy and environmental sustainability. As a materials producer, we can impact, but at
the same time can also benefit the environment. We succeed at the commitment to
sustainability in several traditional and practical ways are and driven by a continuous
improvement mentality: Identifying energy strategies for the future, mastering the
fundamentals of energy management, for instance, the easiest way to save power is to
not use it. In times of an economic downturn, we must look to the low- hanging fruit for
efficiencies. We also benchmarking energy performance and benchmarking best
management practices and because of this Roanoke Cement has been recognized by
the EPA as having an Energy Star manufacturing facility. We are also committed to
recycling. Annually, Roanoke Cement recycles about 200,000 tons of byproducts from
industrial manufacturing facilities and our sister company, Separation Technologies,
recycles approximately one million tons of fly ash each year. Roanoke Cement has a
commitment to energy reduction in non - traditional ways as well. We promote more
durable buildings and better built concrete roads, offer storm water solutions utilizing a
pervious concrete and at the plant, we take measures to protect the biodiversity and
natural surroundings at our facilities. For instance, we have turned a metal scrap yard
into an apple orchard that is pollinated with bee hives. We have reclaimed an old
quarry by turning it into a trout pond and we have an annual creek cleanup day at
Catawba Creek, which runs through our plant property. We also support maintenance
efforts on the Andy Lane Trail which links the Appalachian Trail between McAfee's Knob
January 24, 2012 59
and Troutville. We also partner with groups and agencies like the US Green Building
Council and Trout Unlimited. Educating others on how to reduce energy use is an
important part of what we do for our customers and our community. We have saved our
customers over $1 million by incorporating these money and energy savings ideas. By
applying best practices from our cement plant, we conduct energy audits for customers,
for instance on electrical rate structures and their complexities; we also check air
systems for leaks and false -air consumption; we also measure critical electrical loads
and demonstrate energy- saving opportunities. The trick is to be helpful and not meddle.
Customers need to be able to apply this energy knowledge to their processes by
themselves to remain competitive. Our Company believes in going above and beyond
what is required in regulations and permits. All or most of this was done without
government interactions or requiring us to do it. We've been recognized by the EPA, the
state of Virginia and even Roanoke's own Cool Cities Coalition; and we're proud of that.
We're not advocating strict government regulations. We are however, encouraging you
to continue to track your energy consumption and commend you for looking at ways to
reduce it. This process requires continuous education, innovation, and investment. But
in the end, energy conservation and energy efficiency save money for taxpayers and
businesses like ours.
Chairman Flora recessed at 8:25 for a ten - minute break.
Chairman Flora returned from recess at 8:36 p.m.
Ernie Ragland of 555 North Dry Well Road in Natural Bridge, Virginia in
Rockbridge County. He advised he is a retired federal auditor, who formerly worked for
EPA's Office of Inspector General and is a long time supporter of environmental
protection, of the air we breathe, water quality, drinking water and actions to clean up
the Chesapeake Bay. However, he stated he is not convinced by scientific or empirical
evidence that global warming or climate change regulations by EPA are warranted at
this time. Personally, he believes toxic mercury from coal fired utility plants, which can
be mitigated by improved scrubber technology, and other mercury sources, represents
a bigger threat to the environment than greenhouse gases. Also, he stated he believes
Climate Science, like most other science, is not settled. To what extent is Climate
Change caused by human activity, solar activity, greenhouse gases, electromagnetic
waves and other factors, have not been clearly defined. Many questions have been
raised by the integrity of the data collected and even recently the EPA OIG identified in
their review, that EPA did not comply with OMB requirements for peer review of their
Technical Support Document pertaining to EPA greenhouse gases endangerment
findings. Since the adoption of Agenda 21 in 1992, government has increasingly
assumed the role of forcing its citizens into lifestyles that is considered necessary to
save the planet and to help ensure sustainable management of urban settlements or
development into high- density, planned communities. This may be good policy for
citizens in highly urban areas, such as in Northern Virginia, but statewide he believes it
should not be mandatory and should be up to the local government and its citizens to
decide. Also, I testified earlier today about the high number of bills (4 House Bills and 2
60 January 24, 2012
Senate Bills) to make Urban Development Areas, comparable to Cluster Development
and Smart Growth type areas, an optional requirement to be determined by public
referendum or the locality. He advised he applauds Senator Ralph Smith for sponsoring
Senate Bill 274. He proposes that Urban Development Areas be made optional rather
than mandatory and that any locality that has previously adopted urban development
areas may, and upon voter petition shall, reconsider such action. He believes this bill,
which is substantially comparable to House Bill 92 should be passed and signed into
law. Lastly, after extensive research on UN Agenda 21, he strongly believes Agenda 21
undermines private property rights by subordinating the individual to community and
over time will undermine the U.S. Constitution, which he swore to defend when he was
in the U.S. Navy. He stated he recommends that Roanoke County join other
jurisdictions, such as Albemarle County, Virginia, and Carroll County, Maryland, that
have opted out of ICLEI during calendar year 2011 and recommend the County Board
of Supervisors do the same by formally withdrawing from ICLEI.
Chip Tarbutton of 917 Brughs Mill Road in Fincastle, Virginia and is a Board
member of the Roanoke Tea Party. He stated he is one of the "fringe elements" that
was spoken about earlier. He stated he does most of the writing that people were
referencing earlier on the Roanoke Tea Party website and wanted to talk a little about
that. He stated he has been accused of a lot of things over the last few months by
people, journalists, people like that and he wanted to talk through some of the facts and
they are undisputable facts. First, ICLEI is a UN partner group, no one can dispute this.
If you want, he can show the evidence, the information even from the speakers early in
support of ICLEI admit that. ICLEI has a stated goal of supporting local Agenda 21; that
is undeniable, that is one of their driving forces. Local Agenda 21 specifically discusses
property rights as an obstacle to sustainable development. It specifically talks about
educating people about the need to do this in overcoming the American sort of fixation
with property rights, which is a natural right. He stated he heard somebody say that
ICLEI membership is symbolic. Symbolic of what? ICLEI is harmless; well one of the
speakers who supported ICLEI actually said, "Well, you cannot meet that thirty percent
(30 %) reduction by 2020." Why do you have that, because somebody took a boilerplate
ICLEI resolution, which is boilerplate and handed it in, filled in Roanoke County's
specific information? You are stuck with that resolution because you have an ICLEI
membership. He advised you have a Comprehensive Plan, which is on the County
website, that encouraged people to live in cluster developments and discourages
people from not. It does not say yet what those things are, but somebody is going to
define that at some point. He stated he wanted to talk a little bit about the controversy
around global warming. A lot of people do not think global warming is manmade. There
is good evidence for that. Some people believe it. He does not think the Roanoke
County Board of Supervisors is in a position to make a decision for the County residents
one way or the other on that. In talking about private property and also talking about
sustainability. We hear a lot about sustainability is wonderful and it is great, but no one
on the ICLEI side actually defines what sustainable development means in the real
world. These are things that the UN, which is supported by ICLEI, things like air
January 24, 2012 61
conditioning, roads, he is not making this up, this is from the ICLEI Agenda 21
documentation, which unlike some of the folks in this room, he has taken the time to
read, air - conditioning, roads, fences, livestock, economic assistance that do not
promote environmental issues. We applaud businesses and individuals for supporting
environmental issues. We are environmentally sound. We do not need the County to
tell us how to insulate our houses and we just need to sever the ties with ICLEI and
there is a good planning department in Roanoke County to do these things.
Rudy Vietmeier of 460 Bluebell Lane in Roanoke County stated environmental
protection is not a local issue. The biosphere is global. Many attempts have been
made, as the Board is well aware, to cobble together treaties to address environmental
protection and to promote conservation and none has succeeded. Primarily because
the restriction proposed was seen to be by developed countries onerous. They were
not willing to place their industries at a competitive disadvantage. Clearly, a different
approach is called for and that is what ICLEI does. While treaties fail to accomplish
volunteerism may do that. No one is saddled with regulations, no one is put at a
competitive disadvantage by being more efficient and everyone benefits more from a
more efficient and more sustainable environment. What better forum could there be to
launch such an initiative than the United Nations. If that were to succeed, the UN, after
all these years may finally do something useful.
Noah Tickle of 1603 Frosty Lane and Roanoke County resident since 1956
stated the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, one of ICLEI'S associate Trojan
horses predicts that seventy percent (70 %) of the various species on the planet will be
wiped out if global warming continues at the predicted rate. Floods, droughts,
hurricanes, blizzards and other bad stuff will do us in. "It is all our fault." "Humans are
bad" and they want us to believe in fact the opposite is true. Food crops love CO2. The
solution, the panel says, lies in either mitigation, to finally do something about the
weather, or adaptation, to make the best of their, "Chicken Little ", bad news. Mitigation
relies on regulation, and naturally "the worthies" shakedown science prescribes
mitigation first. Regulation will require many studies, written in the language of
academics that no one else can understand, to be read at elaborate conferences,
always held at luxury resorts that a shakedown scientist could never afford on his own
dime. The conclusion of the learned shakedown artists is invariably about how to milk
the government of the West for more handouts. Commonsense, please ICLEI must go.
It's a particular conceit of man to imagine that he is both the author and the center of the
universe, that whatever happens to the stars is the work of his hand. "We are changing
the large -scale properties of the atmosphere," declares Benjamin D. Santer, a climate
scientist who needs to go back to school. The truth is you can engage in vast planetary
experiments; warming the surface, warming the atmosphere, moistening the
atmosphere and you will not impact on the frequency and duration of extreme events.
Thus the ignorance and arrogance of man delving in God's work. "Everybody talks
about the weather," Mark Twain Said, "But nobody does anything about it." He stated
we cannot, commonsense please, does matter. CO2 is good. ICLEI, RCCLEAR all
62 January 24, 2012
have their heads in the sand. Go ask our food crops. Look, listen, they tell the truth.
They say, "Want us to feed you ?" "More CO2, please." ICLEI must go.
Mike Bailey of 7516 Deerbranch Road stated he is the Chairman of the Roanoke
County Republican Committee and he has been instructed by his membership to
present a resolution recently passed by his organization. He does not recall having to
do this before. All of the members of the committee are registered voters and residents
of Roanoke County. He is happy to report to the Board that there are several counties
within Virginia and the state of Maryland as well as the national republican committee
who recognizes that we can be good stewards of the environment without being
members of ICLEI. Therefore, he will read the resolution from his committee,
"WHEREAS, Roanoke County is a dues paying member of "ICLEI -Local Governments
for Sustainability," previously known as the "International Council for Local
Environmental Initiatives "; and WHEREAS, ICLEI's agenda conflicts with private
property rights and is at odds with our community's beliefs and values; now, therefore,
be it RESOLVED, that the Roanoke County Republican Committee opposes Roanoke
County's membership in ICLEI and urges the Roanoke County Board of Supervisors to
formally withdraw from ICLEI and review any policies that may have been adopted
because of the County's association with ICLEI." Mr. Bailey stated the resolution was
typed up and presented to him by his committee to present to the Board. He stated he
hopes the Board will take this resolution under consideration as well as the many other
resolutions that are being circulated throughout Richmond. While listening to the
comments of the people tonight, he urged the Board to do as Mr. Church suggested in
the very beginning that is to listen to the people. Listen to what they want. We can
protect the environment and their rights without ICLEI.
Mickey Mixon of 4508 Summerset Circle in the Cave Spring magisterial district
stated he is what some in the audience may call a right- winger. He considers himself a
conservative taxpayer, but for the record, he wants the Board to notice that he does not
have horns; he does not drag his knuckles when he walks and he does not eat small
children. In fact, he recycles his trash, own multiple solar panels and have a hybrid
water heater. So, he too believes in the environment and thinks it is an important thing.
But, by the same token, he is very concerned about ICLEI membership. The future
concept of UDA's and ICLEI to him smacks of soviet Russia and how they moved all of
their people into community housing. Right now, there is a bill in the Virginia House of
Delegates, HB91, sponsored by Delegate Bob Marshall and he believes as one of the
earlier speakers mentioned a companion bill by Senator Ralph Smith from the Roanoke
County SB 274 that does the same thing. This bill would make the adoption of UDA's
by local government as optional rather than mandatory. He stated he hopes this passes
and encourages all citizens to contact their House of Delegates member and their
Senator and strongly encourage them to support this bill. The beauty of rural living in
Virginia is a blessing from God. People should never be forced to move off their rural
land and into high density housing in the city. It is un- American and it is against our
property rights as citizens. We can protect the environment without ICLEI. He therefore
urged the Board to remove our membership from ICLEI.
January 24, 2012 63
Max Beyer of 2402 Coachman Drive in LaBellvue stated as a preamble to his
remarks, he wanted to remind the Board that adhering to the principles of democracy
and individual freedom as envisioned by our families are not objectives. They are in
fact a state of being, a process, and a means whereby society moves from point A to
point B. History has proven that political freedom that is life, liberty and the pursuit of
happiness is perceived by and is heavily dependent upon economic freedom, i.e.
private property, and premarket forces. The County staff is concerned about the
process and provisioning government services. They are concerned about moving the
County forward in the most efficient, and effective manner in compliance with rules and
regulations. As guided by the Board in its pronouncements and its work sessions.
They also often look to outside sources to the most innovative and so- called modern
21 century concepts and ideas to accomplish this. Now, beyond this they are not
chartered to look after our individual freedoms; that is political and economic. He stated
the Board is our caretakers. The consequences of your failure is the abolishment of
citizen's rights, liberties and the destruction of citizens' economic freedom. He advised
it really is as simple as that. The Board must recognize each time they restrict the use
of private property, the Board is diminishing economic freedom and while they might be
good reasons for doing so as a rule, such restrictions should be minimized. Adherence
to ICLEI's principles provides the opportunity for imposition of such restrictions on a
quantum basis all in the name of County economic development and the so called
public good. The current stand in evaluating economy development is zoning is not
neutral by any means. By literally buying into the ICLEI action plan, the Board has gone
too far. The Board has established a bias your ability to protect and depend private
property rights and individual liberty through your guidance to your staff and
subsequently in your evaluation of County zoning and economic development actions.
The staff takes it lead from your guidance. One needs to only look at the Glenvar plan
to see examples of the inclusion of Agenda 21 slogans, terms and concepts. The Board
is inconsistent, deceitful in promulgating ICLEI positions while simultaneously
professing support of the American ideals that he talked about earlier. The two stands
cannot logically, simultaneously exist. He respectfully requests that the Board remove
this dilemma by withdrawing the County from ICLEI as many other localities have done
so and as many citizens this evening have also requested.
Susan Edwards of 4121 Givens Road in the Catawba Magisterial District of
Roanoke County stated she is here as an environmental supporter and a citizen and
property owner and taxpayer of Roanoke County. She stated she is an engineer and
she stated she believes in environmental stewardship. She advised she works as an
environmental professional for the State of Virginia. She stated she is not here in her
professional capacity, but as a taxpaying citizen reading some of the information that
she skeptically started looking into about ICLEI. She stated she was concerned when
she heard people talking about property rights. She can understand the interest of our
Planning staff to make good use of good planning documents and going to templates
that are provided by professional organizations. All the sustainability material that is
provided through the American Planning Association and through ICLEI all gets at
64 January 24, 2012
environmental justice and you look through their material and you can see for yourself
what they have in mind. Being part of the Glenvar visioning group, she saw some
processes that are highlighted in ICLEI as training material on consensus process and
how rather than arguing issues you work to shift the direction of the conversation. She
advised she stands with Max Beyer and others that have spoken this evening asking
the Board to withdraw our participation and she advised she was the one who worked
with the resolution on the Roanoke County Republic Committee and ask not only, she is
not so worried about $1,200 a year in the budget, she is worried about our planning
documents and the things that are in place already that are based on the templates and
the training that our staff has undergone as we have participated in ICLEI over the past
few years. Our property rights are not being protected by that group. If you read their
material as she has pulled from their website today, they are opposed to property rights.
They seek environmental justice, energy independence, natural resource conservation,
climate change, dealing with unemployment, poverty and public health. Well, they put a
lot of things out there, but as you work through the documents on their own website,
they are opposed to our individual liberties, freedoms and property rights. So if the
Board would look at their own material and make a serious decision about what this
group is focused on. What are their motives?
Linda LaPrade of 5509 Will Carter Lane and a resident of the Cave Spring district
stated tonight she has listened to the proponents of ICLEI use both derision and flattery
to get their points across. She stated she guessed she was part of a "fringe group"
although she never thought she would be. She guessed she is part of a senseless
conspiracy opposition although she does not see herself that way either and she
guesses you are wise only if you listen to their points of view. She does not feel that
way. In August 2007, when the Board joined ICLEI, the Board was told that it simply
provided tools, software and information and you are told that again tonight. The Board
knows that the tools and software are totally unreliable as shown in the FOIA that she
presented to the Board the last time. There is no validity in software that shows no
scientific procedure in how data is arrived and no auditor has verified it. You only have
the word of ICLEI. The advisors, locally, who helped implement ICLEI all have vested
interests in furthering ICLEI goals, their livelihoods depend upon it and most, if not all,
are not residents of this County and have no vested interest in preserving our rights.
Not one independent expert gave assistance, not one person examined the potential
problems with ICLEI. The staff who wanted ICLEI gathered people biased towards the
decision they wanted, much as Ms. Edwards discussed. When the Board signed, the
Board agreed to further ICLEI goals. In 2008, one of you voting tonight went on record
saying, "I am not interested in participating if mandates are going to be implemented."
ICLEI mandates are being implemented; they may not be mandated, but our goals are
their goals; specifically and word for word. The Board's job is to protect our interests
and our rights against possible threat. Tonight, she stated we will see if you believe that
to be true. We cannot risk how future supervisors will interpret these mandates or what
mandates will occur. We cannot risk losing private property rights and our rural choices
and this is what the Board risks heading down that ICLEI road. Are the Board members
January 24, 2012 65
leaders who will protect their citizens against potential problems and have confidence in
your staff and your volunteers to create and implement appropriate environmental policy
for us or are you followers who allow an outside NGO to dictate and monitor County
policies? We know which kind of people we deserve as our supervisors; your vote will
tell us what you are.
Monica Rokicki of 1211 Fourth Street in Roanoke, Virginia stated she is speaking
from a personal basis, from a professional basis, as a member of the Chamber of
Commerce as someone who is interested in future generations as someone who takes
Thomas Jefferson's words to heart to say that, "We may not by our stewardship of our
current resources rob the rights and liberties of future generations to serve our own
good." That is a nice saying and how do we actually accomplish it? Well, we
accomplish it by utilizing the best scientific evidence and knowledge that we have.
There are minorities that disagree with the majority of scientists who say that climate
change is a fact and it is a fact. So she has to ask herself, well she is an open- minded
person and maybe she should just be open minded about people who do not share her
view, after all open- mindedness is one of the foundational attributes of a functioning
democracy and yet an open mind in regarding the issue of hand are we to be guided by
our open mind and privilege reviews of the few dissenting scientists who are skeptical.
Is it even an appropriate scientific consensus to the extent it puts the future of our
environment, our economy, our air and our children's future's at risk. Let's put it another
way, if an overwhelming consensus of Doctors told a father that his life was at risk, that
he had a life- threatening condition should he keep an open mind and risk leaving his
children fatherless. If, an overwhelming consensus of attorneys told a Board of a
company there was an overwhelming risk with a certain investment should the
company's Board keep an open mind and risk those shareholders investments in that
company, of course not. An open mind is not relevant to a set of facts and an
overwhelming consensus of evidence. Accordingly, the governing bodies of a
community have an obligation to take actions to minimize the risks of climate change.
ICLEI is a tool to make this happen; it is not something that is going to threaten our
rights or our liberties. In fact, it is something that will help to preserve them. She stated
she too has read all of the documents on the ICLEI website and she finds only best
wishes for the future of our country and of our community and of the global community
in those documents. By the way, you can meet all of their challenges.
Jim Woltz of 10561 Sugar Camp Road in Roanoke County stated he wanted to
first thank all of the Supervisors and the founders of our country for giving the privilege
for voicing their opinion here today; he thinks it is a wonderful way that we can express
how we feel. He advised he had moved here in 1973 and did not invest in 401 k, put his
money and invested in real estate herein Roanoke County. He stated he does believe
in the importance of taking care of the environment. He personally has put 1,500 acres
of his own land in a conservation easement. He believes it is our responsibility to take
care of the environment, especially the environment here in Roanoke County that we
are all here tonight to discuss and he is sure there are plenty of good things that ICLEI
provides. He has been to many council meetings around the country. He is in the real
66 January 24, 2012
estate business. He is licensed to do business in nineteen (19) states. He has begged
for property rights and common sense solutions to property rights and ordinances
throughout the country. More regulations, however, is just but one of ICLEI's agendas.
But using the scare tactic of global warming is not a very good tool. One year scientists
say it is happening and one year they say it isn't. Last year we had snow on the ground
for the most part of the year and now this year we are having nice weather. The
agenda for ICLEI does run deep and you have heard the testimony of other people that
have studied it. He advised he has also read both sides of it and believe it does run a
lot deeper than global warming. To take anything from this organization only opens a
portal for more influence to change and diminish property rights. The ones that have
become more and more precious with each taking of property rights through
ordinances. For thirty -eight (38) years, he has watched this County change the property
rights and make them even more valuable through their ordinance changes. They do
not really need any help coming from an outside resource. The County is doing a pretty
good job of that and he understands a lot of them have been needed, but he does
disagree with some of them. There are plenty of resources available to the County to
protect the citizens and educate people with good stewardship how to take care of the
property and the environment and he thinks it is a decision that the citizens of this
county should make as to how this property right issue should be handled. Every
country is different, our happens to have the Fifth Amendment, he does not think we
need outside influence from foreign countries to tell us how we need to handle our rights
for real estate ownership and the ultimate goal of ICLEI is to control how we live and
what we can do with our property. He urged the County to discontinue their
membership with ICLEI and let the citizens of this County decide what rights we should
have.
John Lipscomb of 346 Quail Valley Lane in Boones Mill in Franklin County stated
the reason he is here is because we in Franklin County are following along the Board of
Supervisors along a similar path to what Roanoke County has already tried. It appears
as though they may be two or three years behind. They are not yet a member of ICLEI,
but they are certainly looking as some of the influences of ICLEI and some are thinking
of joining. He advised he just wanted to clarify a few things. He has not prepared any
statements so therefore he is not going to say anything nearly as eloquently as some of
these folks have and appreciates their effort and their speeches, but he is a registered
professional engineer. He has a MBA and is considered as another one of the "fringe
elements." He is also the executive director of the Bedford Franklin Area Tea Party and
he takes time tonight and takes time with the Tea Party and he takes time any time he
can to make sure that this country does not fall for the false promises and the lies and
the tactics used by the United Nations to take over our constitution and take over our
rights. Several things that have been brought up tonight yet and thinks worth
mentioning; in any issue like climate change and notice that the terms has been
changed from global warming to climate change. That is because they found out global
warming does not fly too well. Because back in the 1960's we had global cooling and
he sees a lot of white hair in the audience so he is sure back in the 60's there was
January 24, 2012 67
concern as to how we were going to deal with this horrible situation. So, they had to
change it to climate change instead of global warming. Another thing to mention is that
he is not sure what kind of routers or computers or internet service a lot of these people
are getting because all you have to do is Google Agenda 21 sustainable development
and you will see all of the quotes in there about property rights and how property rights
are not good as far as establishing social justice. That is another one that nobody has
brought up yet; that is also part of the Agenda 21 and the ICLEI bag of tricks. Social
justice is not legal justice, social justice is giving everybody equal money and equal
access to everything. In other words, taking from the rich and giving to the poor. He
stated he believes in the constitution. He is a US citizen and will do everything he can
to uphold the constitution. He would hope that the Board would do the same and that
means rejecting any form of unconstitutional and anti - American activities that are
represented by ICLEI.
Mrs. Robert Hardin of 3044 Stoneybrook Drive in the Windsor Hills District of
Roanoke County. Thank you for taking comments from constituents. I'm sure we all
appreciate that. Mrs. Hardin advised she speaks tonight for myself, but also for my
husband, who usually attended regularly until his Christmas Eve visit to the emergency
room which was followed by a hospital stay and changes and additions to his medicines
and diet, and restrictions like no steps, no shoveling snow, and don't go outside if the
temperature is 40 degrees or lower. Not knowing how long we would be here tonight, he
decided to stay home. I also speak for my adult son, who is staying with him. He
agrees with my opinions on things. Our founding fathers, who in many cases were
better educated than many of us, believed in friendship with all nations, but alliances
with none. My husband, son and I agree. We also think that we Americans are smart
enough to decide our own destiny, and not rely lockstep upon the ideas of others. We
request that you vote to withdraw from ICLEI. We've noticed in the past six or so months
that the Board has taken comments from nonresidents. I kept a record at one meeting.
More than half of the speakers either were from elsewhere, or did not state where they
did live. She advised she respected their passion on the issues; she respects the right
to their opinion. But I remind you that people who are not Roanoke County residents,
people that are not represented by the Board and will not be affected by the decisions
that the Board makes. She advised she hoped the Board has been making notes of
what County residents options were and you will keep them in mind when you decide on
this or any other issue and she advised she could not help adding an ad lib, talking
about global warming our own television station WDBJ told us one day this week that it
is snowed in the Sahara desert, the third time in all recorded history.
Charles Wertalik of 3116 Valley Stream Drive in the Mount Pleasant area of the
County stated he is here to ask the Board to get rid of the County's membership in
ICLEI. No less of an authority than the Heritage Foundation, the foremost conservative,
think tank in this country with 7010 thousands members has written about it recently
and they say among other things, "Ready to trade in your car for a bike, or maybe a
subway instead? Interested in fewer choices for your home, paying more for housing,
and being crammed into a denser neighborhood? You can have all this and more
68 January 24, 2012
radical environmentalists and "smart growth" advocates have their way and local, state,
and the federal government impose the policies set forth in the United Nations' Agenda
21." which we have heard a lot of tonight. So, he will not go any further. Part of the
threat that Americans need to be concerned about is the one that lies in their own
backyard, namely, these so called homegrown, smart growth policies that undermine
the quality of life, personal choice and property rights in American communities. Where
do they stand today, these homegrown policies? The Obama administration has
embraced them while also increasing environmental regulations and restriction on use
of natural resources. The White House is not the only one behind the smart growth
movement, local and state officials along with interest groups are promoting the policies
at all levels of government, like right here. That is where smart growth must be
thwarted. It is not just a matter of standing against the implementation of Agenda 21 at
the national level. It is also about protecting our own backyards against the homegrown
threat and he is all for that. He would not want any of these togetherness situations
sound too much like Stalag 17.
Diana Christopulos of 907 Greenbrier Court in Salem, Virginia thanked the Board
for the opportunity to speak on behalf of Roanoke Valley Cool Cities Coalition, a
nonprofit organization of all volunteers, no staff, no building, but they do have 250
affiliates representing over 25,000 citizens in this region; the vast majority of them live,
work or do business in Roanoke County. Just a couple of quick points. One of the
speakers said that the scientists used to talk about global warming and now talk about
climate change. Actually, scientists have always talked about only climate change, just
to make it clear about that there was no change. Secondly, there has not been any
debate for the last ten (10) years among scientists. Our own national academy of
Science has been very clear about global warming. They did a poll of their members
last year. This is the most distinguished, academic and scientific gathering in America.
98 out of one hundred (100) climate scientists said a) global warming is happening and
b) we are cognizant. Just to be clear, those are actually facts. We support the County's
continued membership in ICLEI and we support the County's leadership in efforts to
save energy and save money for the County's taxpayers. We endorse the efforts of
RCCLEAR, a committee of this Board of Supervisors to help local resident, businesses
and others save energy and save money and frankly, we are puzzled by the Tea Party's
ongoing efforts, not only in Roanoke County, but in well- funded, well - planned effort, all
over the County funded by groups like the Heritage Foundation to discourage energy
conservation. Who benefits from wasted energy? When Governor McDonald visited
Roanoke County is 2010, one of the local Tea Party leaders who spoke tonight attacked
him for wanting to make Richmond more green and the governor replied, "Part of being
conservative is conservation." We agree with the governor. She stated she was in a
public meeting here in Roanoke County about a year ago where a speaker was talking
about energy conservation and gave examples of how much energy we were wasting
here in America and one of the local Tea Party members who spoke here tonight, a
different one, interrupted the speaker to say, "but that is what makes us special."
Really? Is wasting energy what makes America special? I grew up in a military family.
January 24, 2012 69
Now, she will guarantee you that her parents did not teach us that wasting energy made
us special except for being singled out for criticism. She stated her mom is 87 years
ago and she still makes sure they turn out the lights when we leave a room. Our friends
in the Tea Party have had their say about ICLEI and energy conservation and the Board
of Supervisors has listened and listened and listened. We have heard many examples
tonight of information from the Tea Party in Rockbridge County, Franklin County,
Botetourt County about the United Nations and Soviet Union, the Environmental
Protection Agency, interpretations of climate science and many other things, but very
little about the work of RCCLEAR, very little about the voluntary work that is being done
here and we ask the Board to continue the membership and heed the words of St. Paul,
instead of the rancor that we have heard from some of the others here to encourage
one another and build each other up and we hope that is the action you will take.
Donald Koop of 6700 Christopher Drive in Cave Spring stated he would like to
bring to the discussion an indication of what others are saying about ICLEI. He advised
he would be reading a quote from a candidate for congress from the 11 District in
North Carolina. He is not a member of Roanoke Tea Party. This came across his desk
today and thought it was appropriate to bring to the Board's attention tonight. "The
elimination of private property ownership in all forms is the cornerstone of Marxism and
its plan for a one -world collectivist tyranny. Socialism, Communism, and the Marxist
agenda are not dead. They did not disappear 20 years ago when the Berlin Wall fell and
the Soviet Union disintegrated. Instead, Marxists realized that they could defeat us from
the inside by destroying our moral integrity, the family unit, and using the environmental
movement to destroy our industrial base. We've heard these arguments before from
the mouths of those who claim to act for the benefit of mankind out of selfless disregard
for their own well- being. They say, 'It's for your own good,' or 'It's for the collective
good'. If they are so smart and know so much that they believe we should be grateful for
the opportunity to allow them to control our lives. Meanwhile, they are personally
exempt from the rules. Their 'Do as I say, not as I do' mentality and attitude
characterizes the elitist ideology. Agenda 21 is the weapon Marxists have chosen to
create a socialist, redistributive society. Under the guise of 'sustainability', America
would lose her sovereignty to a one -world government run by self- appointed elitists,
shielded by the banner of the United Nations. Confiscation of private property would
force all human beings to live in prison -like, high -rise cubicles in 'smart' urban zones. All
aspects of our lives would be closely monitored and strictly regimented. Agenda 21 is,
therefore, the single greatest threat to our individual freedom. When the stark choice of
slavery or freedom presented itself to Patrick Henry, his proclamation, Give me liberty or
give me death,' served as the rallying cry for American patriots. I, for one, cannot and
will not accept continued loss of personal freedom and further restrictions of my rights
while the Constitution is ignored. I have signed the Resolution below exposing United
Nations Agenda 21 and urge the Republican National Committee to do the same. I also
challenge all public officials and candidates for public office to join me in condemning
70 January 24, 2012
sustainable development. On these matters of principle, compromise is not an option.
Dr. Dan Eichenbaum"
Chairman Flora recessed at 9:27 p.m. and returned to open session at
9:36 p.m.
Supervisor Moore commented she would like to thank everyone for
coming out this evening and voicing their viewpoint. ICLEI is a non - profit organization
that we gather information from or that they gather information from all over the world.
We can use this information if we want to help make our choices on how to improve our
community and how to make them safer for our next generation. For the small amount
of money that Roanoke County spends each year to be a member of ICLEI, we are able
to receive valuable information about what is going on from all over the world. ICLEI
members consist of elected officials including mayors, governors and town and city
managers. We can learn from their mistakes and from their experiences through the
information that we receive. No one is forcing us to use this information, but we will be
able to use it as a guideline if we want to. She stated she has heard some talk about
national security concerns by being involved in ICLEI. We communicate every day by
telephone, cell phone, social media outlets, such as twitter and Facebook. We talk
about our families, our finances, our vacations and sometimes our entire itinerary is
posted everyday on Facebook. If someone wanted to hack into those computers, they
could do it. They could listen to our conversations and they could harm us if they
wanted to, but this is America and we cannot be afraid to go outside every day and go
about our routines afraid that someone will harm us. My son left home and joined the
Navy at age 19; he is now overseas somewhere; she does not know where. He is
fighting for our freedom. We, as Board Members, make decisions based on fact and
what is best for our citizens. The decisions that are made in our locality may not apply
to what other localities use. We make our own decisions. It is good to have information
other localities have talked about and reviewed, discussed as well as other countries
and other states so we can apply them if we want to. We can use the information as a
guideline. She added that she thinks ICLEI is a valuable tool for Roanoke County to
use that offers an opportunity to stay in touch with the rest of the world in protecting our
environment. We need to keep moving forward and keep searching for ways that we
can help maintain our valley with clean air and water for our next generation. ICLEI is a
good investment for our future. It is a resource that we can use to help make good
decisions and sustainability for her means clean water and clean air.
Supervisor Church inquired of Mr. Goodman if he would advise when the
dues were paid for 2012 for ICLEI with Mr. Goodman responding October 21, 2011.
Supervisor Church stated he considers himself a conservative; he is not happy with
Washington, DC. He stated he is not happy with a lot of things going on in this world.
When he feels like our country, which he believes is the greatest nation in the world is
being subjected to what he would call outside forces and it can be anyone, anybody any
country, outside the United States. He advised we are constantly fighting wars of all
kinds, physically, mentally and socially. He keeps asking himself over and over all
these months, what is the ruckus, what's the ruckus about? You know there used to be
January 24, 2012 71
an old saying, "Follow the money." Well, a lot of people say it's not the money, it's the
principle of the thing; and he replies ten to one it is the money. There is always
something to gain somewhere, somehow that we may not even know about. He further
stated he is skeptical of government, our government, with stimulus plans, grants,
projects, etc. because history shows once they run off of money they leave. Our history
shows that. He stated he is not saying they did it on purpose, but we're talking about
millions upon millions of dollars that are all of a sudden that which was a great idea four
or five years ago now is a piece of rusted metal. He stated he tries to be a no
nonsense, logical thinking guy. He keeps saying to himself that the people who believe
are good people, good honest citizens; as well as the people that do not believe. At this
point, he questions some of the supposed benefits; who are they really for? He stated
he thinks mentally that it's their way or acts like it's their way or the highway that sends
signals to him in different ways. He asked the rhetorical question that if we vote yes to
keep this, will our citizens leave us and never come back; of course not. However, if the
Board were to vote no, would an organization still be around us all the time, would they
be still talking to us and doing things? He wonders about that. Our citizens are here to
say and it is his job as an elected representative to listen to his citizens; 18,848 at last
count. They let me know what they think because they know that they can reach me
and contact me. Their blood, sweat, and tears are what he listens to the best of his
ability. It all comes down to the organization; believer or non - believer. What he does
not like to hear is if the organization id dropped, i.e. ICLEI that the County quits
conserving; that it quits caring. He stated he does not believe for one minute if any
organization, even refuses to sell us their software, wants no part of us, let's go to that
extreme, he still believes that Roanoke County is going to do the best it can to conserve
what it has; he truly believes that. There are competent people in Roanoke County:
directors, workers, maintenance, etc. He advised he does not have proof to show that
the County would be out of $20,000 that it would cost us $20,000 or $30,000 to do this
or that, but would like to see some proof of it. He would like to see proof about a lot of
things. He advised he would like to back up and go back to sheet number one. In 2007,
to be candid and honest, our Board voted to join this organization. He stated he
honestly feels that with all his heart, the Board had no idea. This board member didn't,
and he is not putting down any of them. It's a situation that sounded good; something
that the Board all believed in. He advised he thinks everybody in this room wants to
conserve our precious energy and the Board really had no idea. Agenda 21 is a card
game to me. He is not trying to say he is nonchalant about it, but it was something that
appeared to be something Roanoke County should do, go ahead and conserve energy
and take care of it. He stated he really did not honestly realize the ramifications or the
what ifs or what nots, that we can see today, four years plus later. He advised he has
spent his life believing in Ruby Church, who left this earthly world, his mother, in 2001,
had a third grade education and was the smartest person in the world; she taught me a
lot of things such as always believe in God, in the end we win. She knew what that
means; if it seems to be too good, it's not. There's never a right way to do a wrong
thing. Believe in your country, it is the greatest country in this world. She was never
72 January 24, 2012
proven wrong, not that I tried to prove her wrong. She cared with a heart that you could
not believe. Supervisor Church stated one of the most thankful things he is thankful for
is that we passed away just before 9/11; feels that would have broken her heart in two.
She did not have to live through what we are living through. Does he think someone is
going to come in here and attack us; no. He just believes with all his being that we can
do the job that we should be doing on our own and is not convinced about some of the
technology. For example, he stated he has some recessed floodlights at home. He
advised they are kind of expensive; he used to buy them for $1.98 and lasted a good
while. When he purchased the new expensive ones that are supposed to last seven
(7) years and marked on each one with a Sharpie; one lasted a year and one month
and three that never made two years. He advised he paid $7.90 for these "long- lasting"
ones and could have bought three of the old ones and still be good. He explained his
point is that everything that you are told and proposed is not always what it seems to
be; some things are what they are supposed to be. He explained if he is going to take a
chance and he does not take chances with people's lives, he is going to vote with his
citizens, who have overwhelmingly called, emailed or stopped him on the street and
asked him to vote no.
Supervisor Elswick stated he guessed he been called a lot of things, for
example a maverick in the paper. He further stated he and his neighbors have been
called "zealots and nuts" over the windmill issue. Tonight he is part of a "fringe element."
He stated he is so proud of himself. He advised that somebody once remarked, "I kinda
like Ed, but don't know what he's gonna say. " There is a little truth to that. Supervisor
Elswick continued by stating the cost to ICLEI is totally irrelevant; twelve hundred bucks
is nothing, but the impact of ICLEI is very relevant. You don't notice it. Some of it is
insidious and some of the things that ICLEI's doing in getting people like us and mayors
of a lot of cities in the country to become a part of the ICLEI initiatives are things that
our government refused to do. He continued by stating there are so many good,
capable people on the County staff; highly qualified, highly paid. They have done a
good job with the zoning, except for maybe going a little overboard on the rural areas.
Additionally, the people on RCCLEAR, he is sure are dedicated and fine citizens. He
added he thinks we ought to be able to use our own brains and our own ingenuity. We
are part of the United States. Who do we have to ask how to do almost anything? He
continued by applauding the RCCLEAR volunteers. He stated he agreed we should try
to save energy, but he does want people to stop calling each other names; he has been
called names. Also, the Tea Party has been criticized. He explained he could do a lot
of damage by naming some names and situations that would be embarrassing for those
who advocate ICLEI, but he is not going to do so because he does not feel that is the
way we ought to conduct business. He advised we should agree to try to save energy
and to present the facts. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. He explained it really
helps a lot if people present facts so we can make intelligent decisions. ICLEI and the
UN initiatives are convincing. They sound good on paper and they're a lot like some of
the things we're already doing. He explained if you look close at the involvement with
any organization that is a world organization, you should take a good look at it and its
January 24, 2012 73
ultimate objective and make sure that whatever you're doing with that organization is in
our national interest. He advised staff sends a lot of information to ICLEI. It goes to
ICLEI headquarters in Bonn, Germany. Roanoke County just awarded Trane a $1.4
million contract to improve our energy usage. Trane has software, and from what he
understands it's $2,000, But if it weren't that amount, he is sure for $1.4 million a lot of
help could be obtained through Trane and feels it is a good initiative on the part of
Roanoke County, to try to improve how it uses all its various pieces of equipment.
Supervisor Elswick stated however with regard to the piece of paper that is the report
sent to ICLEI headquarters. This report states Roanoke County did 66 residential
energy audits and every one of those people improved their houses, every one of them
and saved 198 tons of CO2. He asked if anyone really believed all those houses where
those energy audits were conducted. He advised a lot of those improvements had to
cost a lot of money and not a lot of people have a lot of money. He asked the audience
if everyone really believes that all of them implemented what the recommendations
were. Additionally, pamphlets were handled out at a conference, paper pamphlets and
an assumption was made the hundred (100) people that took those pamphlets on how
to improve their energy usage went right home and did what that pamphlet told them to.
He advised he gets pamphlets when he goes to conferences and they usually go in the
first trash can as he goes out the door. So, Roanoke County saved a hundred tons of
CO2 by handing out pamphlets. If that were possible, then we ought to be standing on
every street corner in Roanoke handing out pamphlets. Roanoke County would save
millions of tons of CO2. The same thing was true when they gave out one hundred
(100) driving energy tips such as be consistent, be steady, don't hot rod it. All of those
people did what that pamphlet told them to and we saved another 100 tons. If anyone
has observed drivers driving any more efficiently, then I'd like to know about it because
he has not seen anyone change their driving habits. So, the report says that Roanoke
County saved those tons of carbon dioxide. He assumes the report went to Germany.
Germany then goes to the UN and ICLEI headquarters in Germany goes to whoever
has money and is willing to throw it around when somebody tells them they're doing
something green without checking it out, and therefore ICLEI headquarters gets tons of
money. For example, they had enough money to send two of our people, Anne Marie
Green and Charlotte Moore, to a conference. When you send two people to a
conference, and he does not know where it was, probably Las Vegas, then that is
probably ten (10) times what our dues were. Where did they get that money? If we only
pay $1,200 a year in dues, then how can they afford to spend $5,000 to or $6,000 to
send two of our people to a conference? He reiterated something does not make
sense. Any other localities are signing ICLEI agreements to do certain annual reporting
and perform certain actions as dictated by the agreement. Some of them our
government has refused to abide by and to enter into. He outlined his problem as not
liking to see Roanoke County compromise our integrity. As far as he is concerned,
reports cannot be sent out that have absolutely no validity and have not been checked
out, which he does not like. He appreciates the people in Roanoke County and the
neighborhood where he lives as being honest, upfront people; everybody has an
74 January 24, 2012
opinion and they ought to be able to express it. However, he does not appreciate
dreaming up numbers as if we were doing something that we're not doing. There must
be some pressure somewhere from somebody to show some kind of results; obviously
your reported data goes to somebody. He added there is a thirty percent (30 %) UN
recommended reduction in energy; as one of our speakers pointed out, that number
was adopted without any rationale as to how Roanoke County is going to get there.
Roanoke County is just going to save thirty percent (30 %) of its energy. Supervisor
Elswick then stood and flicked the lightswitch on and off and stated he just saved
energy, but did the pamphlets do that, no, he does not think so. He added if you look at
any of the initiatives, look at a war. If it is a UN sanctioned war, who fights, not a lot of
countries, primarily just the free countries. Who will respond to a UN initiated ICLEI-
type program, only the free countries. The third world countries do not even have time
as they are fighting all the time and they are not going to abide by these rules, they are
just not going to enter into that. Who pays for the wars? We pay most of it and we
allow the UN people to take over New York City and do things that citizens there cannot
do and they do not get prosecuted for it. Take a look at who has the money in the
world, China has over $3 trillion in cash and liquid asset reserves, Japan has $900
billion and the United States has $140 billion. However, we are putting out the money
to feed people through UN initiates. We are called upon when anything needs to be
done because we are the United States and should be on the same level as everybody
else even though we are busting, even though we are working hard to establish a
standard of living that the world envies and they want to take it away from us and give it
to somebody else. If you look at some of the programs, for example Salvation Army is
his favorite charity. Because the person who runs the Salvation Army has a salary of
$13,000 a year. The UN agency, the guy that runs that gets $1.3 million. Who is really
in it for the money and who's in it to help people? Supervisor Elswick stated these were
just a few of the notes that he made and he stated he thinks locally we should be honest
with each other and if we are going to do something, do something; not pretend that we
did. He stated let us do our best to work with coal companies and AEP to get the coal
plants converted to natural gas, which we have tons of. If all of the subsidies that
government is putting out to various organizations had gone to converting the coal -fired
plants to natural gas, we would have cut the emissions by an incredible amount; yet we
just throw money at untried technologies. For example, denude another mountaintop;
that will solve the fact that coalminers denuded one. Let's denude another one and it'll
counteract each other he guesses. Additionally, he noted the water authority is taking
methane from the landfill and they will generate enough electricity from that landfill that
they won't have to buy any; that's a good project and not the only project that can be
done. For example, look at our schools. Cars are lined up for miles to pick up their kids,
and yet the school buses are half empty. Some of that is obviously legitimate. Don't
anybody get mad at me because you pick up your kids. Legitimate ones ought to be
allowed. He stated he thinks our children are getting lazy. We don't even let them walk
up the driveway anymore. So, if there was an initiative to talk to those parents and say,
folks, why are you doing this? Let's save some gasoline. He noted he has a neighbor
January 24, 2012 75
who just installed solar panel. They're built for electricity and November's bill was $20.
The bill in December is $50; and they were on vacation. Solar panels are a good thing,
but to get them, we will have to find some company to work with who will give us a deal
because right now, they are way too expensive for most of us to afford. They would
never pay for themselves. In conclusion, Supervisor Elswick stated the audience now
has his opinion on quite a few elements, even if a little discombobulated. He reiterated
he does not think we ought to let anybody come in and tell us what to do. If we can do it
ourselves then we need to do so.
Supervisor Altizer thanked each and every side for the most part being
very respectful to one another and coming to the Board and expressing their opinion
and hopefully you felt like you were able to do that. When I go back and look at this I
guess, like Mr. Church said, follow the money sometimes, and I think is it about the
money? He stated he has heard a lot about personal property rights but has not heard
anyone say what we as a Board has interfered with property rights but he knows there
has been people who have said thank you for protecting those rights. He stated he is a
Republican and that is not a secret to anyone. He is a conservative. He stated he is
probably the least green person on this board, but also realizes there are some things
that work for us and have benefits. He stated he also remembered the night that the
Board was talking about UDAs and he was talking that night that we just need to send
the State a message and say no. There was a lot of heads shaking up and down and
we see a lot of heads shaking up and down now. He advised he thought Chairman
Flora came up with a better idea to just table it and see what the State says to do. He
indicated he thought he was just sending a message to the State that this was the right
way to do, but in that case he violated the Constitution of the State of Virginia. The
State of Virginia gives the Board the ability to do certain things and certain things it does
not. One thing is that if the State tells you to do something, you're going to do it. So
we were somewhat civil disobedient, by not doing it, but it was done for the right
reasons and for the things we believed in and sometimes you have to do those things.
Quite frankly, one of the bills in Richmond right now is making UDAs mandatory and
giving us a choice of whether to do it. He stated he believes there should have been
bills to do away with UDAs all together; that would have been the right thing to do. He
stated he has friends here tonight from the Republican party, one of his neighbors from
down the street who he has shoveled with my snow blower snow out of his drive. He
stated when his friends in the legislature voted for UDAs, he did not distance himself
from those individuals. He explained he has to believe in his own ability because he is
a part of the process that determines whether your rights, property rights or anything
else, is infringed upon. He stated is not whether Roanoke County is in ICLEI or not in
ICLEI. Its right here; the buck stops right here. He stated he believes only ninety
percent (90 %) of what the UN puts out and as he has told many people before he does
not believe with what Roanoke County has paid to ICLEI with what we have received
that there has not been somewhat of a benefit. He explained but what does he do when
someone tells him one of the social agencies is maybe doing something they don't like
and maybe we should pull the funding out from behind that. With ICLEI he is absolutely
76 January 24, 2012
torn, but also has the confidence in himself and he knows the difference between when
somebody's trying to brainwash him or tell him what to do. He has enough confidence
in himself that he is going to make the right decision for the people in his district and for
the people in Roanoke County as a whole. He stated there will be some people who
are mad at him tonight and hopefully they can respectfully disagree. He stated he is
going to do the best he can to make it decisions every day and to protect rights. He has
a record of that and is going to continue to do so. No organization, no person is going
to tell him and he is going to do this or that based on something that came from
Germany or New York or wherever. He explained that someone talked about process
earlier; the process and the agenda of Roanoke County is moved by people and moved
by the five (5) people that sit behind the dais based on a philosophy of what they have
always believed in, and what they have always consistently stood for. It is not for one
group here tonight and he is not against any one group. But again, with the UDAs he
did not distance himself from my friends in Richmond. He stated he is not saying ICLEI
is his friend, but he does not think there is a justification that states we are not getting
out of that organization because we are not getting $1,200 worth of benefits for all the
citizens of Roanoke County. Roanoke County received benefits, they get nothing from
us. He stated he thinks this Board as a whole has voted to protect rights and to make
sure that we do something the right way; this is where he stands.
Supervisor Flora stated that four people have spoken and he has kept his
mouth shut. He explained he is at a disadvantage here because by education he is a
political scientist, which means he has studied politics and government most of my life.
He stated by training he is a public administrator, 40 some years as city /county
manager, but his emphasis has been in planning and that is what he did for so many
years. He stated he finds it a bit interesting because back in the 1950s the general
assembly allowed planned unit development. Although planned unit developments
were although everywhere, it was still the concept of planned unit developments to
develop a large parcel of land into residential and commercial businesses so you could
ride your bicycle from your home to do your grocery shopping or go to the drugstore or
go to the dentist or go to the doctor's office but still a kind of a rural development but it
was called planned unit development. Then along in about the mid 1980s, came cluster
zoning, which was another way to bring more people closer together. The payoff there
was you allowed people to live a little closer together, but then you had to set aside
about thirty to forty percent (30 to 40 %) of all your land as open space, thereby creating
some open areas so all of the development was not taken up with checker boarding all
over the place with lots. We have had a progression in Virginia of development that
started with planned unit development and ended with RDU Rural development; we
have come a long way. Chairman Flora stated the biggest difference in all of that was
that planned unit development, cluster zoning, were all options. Now, the State is trying
to tell the localities how to do something, which they have the power to do as Virginia is
a Dillon Rule state. The State has the power to tell localities what to do and we do not
have the power to say no. In this case, Roanoke County procrastinated because we
knew we were right and he thinks history, through this session of the General Assembly
January 24, 2012 77
is going to prove that we are right. He stated with regard to those arguments that they
have been around forever, he just does not believe that Agenda 21 has anything to do
with this new concept of development. It's just a progression that came along that the
downside was it was mandated as opposed to being optional. He advised he is also a
very strong believer in the Constitution. The last time he checked the US Constitution
was still intact, the Virginia Constitution was still intact and we still had a democracy,
which means that we can elect our people until we choose not to reelect them, and if we
do not like what they are doing we can unelect them and we can elect people who are
more in tune with what the general public wants. As a result, he stated he cannot
believe that ICLEI is a Marxist conspiracy that is trying to take over our government
from within. He explained he is old enough to remember the 1950s and 1960s when we
debated Communism and it was a pretty ugly debate. There were people who lost a lot
of their liberties because they were suspected of being Communists; it was proven that
they never were. Actors, movie directors, and a lot of politicians, lost everything they
had because a member of congress decided that they were a Communist. This country
is so strong in its belief in freedom and liberty that he cannot believe that the general
public will ever give up that right to anyone. The UN has absolutely no authority; they
have virtually outlived their usefulness by the mid 1970s. They were a good
organization for a while, but they have pretty much outlived their usefulness, but I don't
believe they are out there to take over this country by any means. They cannot even
control their own operations. If not for the United States, they would be out of business
because we pay a huge percentage of the cost of the UN. One person made a
comment that people at the UN can do anything they want to and get by with it. Well,
any county that has an embassy in our country has diplomatic immunity, which means if
they come over here as a diplomat, they can do pretty much anything they want. We
can deport them, but we cannot arrest them and send them to jail because they have
immunity from that prosecution. If they have an embassy with England or France or any
other of approximately one hundred countries that have that same thing. He advised
here he is not convinced that ICLEI is the three - headed monster that it has been
represented to be. He believes it offers some good; does not believe that it has
anything to do with the way we run our county and it never will. No matter how much
we talk about ICLEI and how much we use their services or use their methods or their
educational tools, they will never tell us how to run the county. This Board has been
elected to make those decisions ourselves and if we are not smart enough to know the
difference between what's right and what's wrong, then we need to be kicked out.
Accordingly, he added he does not believe that getting out of ICLEI is going to change
anything one way or another. It's going to make some people happy and some people
unhappy. He stated the way he counted the room tonight and he normally does not
count votes before he makes a decision, there is a real argument on both sides and
everyone has a right to their opinion. He stated he also has a right to his opinion and I
respect everyone's opinion out there and hope they respect his right to his own opinion.
Supervisor Elswick commented he had one more question for Mr. Goodman or
Anne Marie Green. He inquired as to what grants Roanoke County has received
78 January 24, 2012
through RCCLEAR, what happened to the money and who managed it, has it been
audited and how was it spent. Mr. Goodman stated we received a grant from the
stimulus funds, which was for $372,000, and it has been utilized to pay for some of the
improvement that has been done on the County equipment and some funds were used
to pay for the residential and commercial energy audits. We can get Mr. Elswick the
financial records and everything he would like to see. Supervisor Elswick then inquired
if there was a $50,000 grant that Cool Cities managed with Mr. Goodman stating not to
his knowledge, but he would check. Supervisor Elswick stated he would also double
check where he received the information and made a motion to dissolve Roanoke
County's membership in ICLEI. Supervisor Moore made a substitute motion to continue
the member in ICLEI. Supervisor Flora inquired of Mr. Mahoney if the Board worked on
the substitute motion first and if it passed, the second motion does not exist. Supervisor
Flora stated if you vote for the motion, it means Roanoke County stays in ICLEI and if
you vote against the motion, it means Roanoke County comes out of ICLEI. The
substitute motion carried by the following recorded vote:
AYES: Supervisors Moore, Altizer, Flora
NAYS: Supervisors Church and Elswick
IN RE: REPORTS AND INQUIRIES OF BOARD MEMBERS
Supervisor Moore thanked Diana Rosapepe, Penny Lloyd and the entire
Library Board for all of the hard work on the new South County Library advising it is an
incredible new addition to our neighborhood and is an incredible building. She next
congratulated the following elementary schools for receiving the Governor's Award for
Educational Excellence: Clearbrook, Oak Grove, Bonsack, Glen Cove, Green Valley,
Penn Forest and Cave Spring. She reiterated this makes the fourth straight year that
Cave Spring Elementary has received the award and the third straight year that it has
been awarded to Clearbrook Elementary. Supervisor Moore then invited everyone to
come out on February 4, 2012, from 10:00 a.m. until 4:00 p.m. for the "Tons of Fun"
event at Tanglewood Mall. It is a great event and staff works very hard in putting this
together. She then reminded Roanoke County and Vinton Small business Owners that
Roanoke County is giving away free energy checkups. If they own or lease a building
that is under 6,000 square feet and you pay your own utility bills and would like to see
how you can possibly save forty percent of your utility bills, please contact Jim Vodnik at
387 -6115.
Supervisor Church stated he heard a newscast last night that our federal
employees owe about $1 billion in unpaid taxes. He stated he finds this to be appalling
and unbelievable. This amount includes almost $10 million in House and Congress
Staff and other House employees, including the left wing of the White House. There are
bills regarding these items which were published by the IRS, but they are all stuck in
committees. These include postal workers, federal workers at every level. There are
no repercussions for nonpayment; not one person has lost their job. The Directors of all
January 24, 2012 79
of our federal agencies get a report annually from the IRS showing the listing of
employees. Again, nothing is done. He further added the irony of this is that he and
everyone else's taxes pay these peoples salaries. He stated he recalled six or seven
years ago, maybe ten that he owed $1,412 and he thought they were going to arrest
him before it could be paid, of course he paid but he felt threatened by this. Don't just
call and talk to your Senator and Congressman. demand some action on this. This is
ludicrous. Again, this is our federal government and they wonder why we are trillions of
dollars in debt.
IN RE: ADJOURNMENT
Chairman Flora adjourned the meeting at 10:26 p.m. to Wednesday,
February 1, 2012, at 6:00 p.m. for a joint meeting with the Roanoke County School
Board, Roanoke County Administration Building. Fourth Floor Training Room 5204
Bernard Drive, Roanoke, VA.
Submitted by: Approved by:
Z 44u4 ( `- 4tiz� C. Jack
Clerk to the Board
G, O�
Richard C. Flora
Chairman
80 January 24, 2012
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